Sexless Japan – Really?
Blue on Dec 11 2006 at 12:08 am | Filed under: Japan: Culture
With maid cafes where pretty young girls that ooze submissiveness to their “masters”, and “shuccho health” (出張ヘルス, basically, dial-a-prostitute) and soap-lands (sensual bathing houses with soapy special service) to vending machines for porn, and specialty shops with used high school girl underwear; Japan, at least on the surface appears one of the most sexually proactive nations in the world. Japanese men are as perverted (if not more perverted) than those in other countries, and as for the ladies, on top of being naturally feminine (with petite sexy bodies, skin that doesn’t seem to change complexion from childhood, pretty faces and silky black hair), the women of Japan have no misconceptions about what style – clothes, perfume and make up – makes a man stop in his tracks, and rouse that tingle in his loins.
When interacting with others, sex and everything surrounding it is fair game for a topic of conversation in Japan and, it is certainly not frowned upon by religious groups or society at large as it is in the USA and other countries. When it comes to secreting sexual hormones and sexuality in general, almost nothing is taboo in Japan – until that is, the day one gets married, or so it seems. Indeed in stark sexual contrast, Japan may be suffering from a sexual drought, where being totally open about sex and being sexy in general, doesn’t seem to be converted into the ins-and-outs of baby making when it comes to married couples.
Shown in these statistics, a recent survey by Japan’s health ministry found that as many as one-third of all marriages in Japan are sexless. The problem is now so widespread that the government fears it is a major contributor to the dramatic plunge in Japan’s birthrate (now only 1.28 births per woman). This sexless phenomenon is not only found in those relationships that are plunging down the drain toward divorce, but to the contrary, more and more couples that consider themselves healthily married (and have no intention of separating), have not had sex with each other in the last month or more (the common definition of “sexless” in Japan), with many saying that they have not had sex together in the last 6 months to one year.
According to the most recent survey of 41 nations last October, the average Japanese has intercourse 45 (and according to Bayer Pharmaceuticals as low as 17) times a year, compared with the global average of 103. Japan is repeatedly at the bottom of the list. Last year it trailed Singapore, which was 28 shags a year higher!
The term “sexless”, was first used in Japan in the early 1990s, but now is instantly recognizable to the Japanese as a universally understood concept, and widely discussed in the media. There are books on the subject and thousands websites and heartbreaking blogs discussing sexless Japan, while letters on the subject fill agony columns on “dear doctor”-type sites.
One in five sexless couples say they view sex simply as a nuisance. A small number cite the lack of a private space, because children or elderly parents often sleep just the other side of a paper-thin door, leading many married couples to even sleep in separate rooms. Mitsui Home announced recently in an Asahi Newspaper article, that in 30% of the new houses they build, the couples are asking for 2 “master” bedrooms. This is a shocking statistic, which shows that sexless couples want to continue living their lives together – separately! “We are sort of room-mates rather than a married couple”, one 31-year-old man, who had not had sex with his wife for two years, told the Asahi Shinbun.
There are many other theories about why the Japanese become less inclined to raunchy evenings in the sack together, but likely it is a mixture of some of these:
- Stress of work/life in Japan (maybe the taihen cloud?)
- Lack of understanding, and usage of contraception, especially “the pill” (who wants to use condoms with their wife!?), making sex with your wife viable only when you want to have a baby
- Abundance of 不倫 (furin, or extra-marital) relationships
- More and more Japanese women choosing career over family
- A tendency among Japanese married couples to feel an aversion to sex with their spouse, not because they dislike one another, but rather because they feel that they have more of a sister-brother relationship; the sanctity of which would be destroyed with a repulsive incest-like feeling, by what westerners would consider normal conjugal relations
The last point is an interesting one, as in the past, it has been traditionally Japanese women who complained that they couldn’t see their hubby “as a member of the opposite sex.” But in the last few years, there’s been an exponential increase in men who can’t view their wives as sexual partners either. While it is true that many Japanese married couples seem to be sexless in nature, they key thing to remember is that this certainly does not mean that they lack the desire for sexual fulfillment. While marriage and children may bring on a sex drought in the home, Japanese people who want (and in the case of most men, need) sex do not simply abstain from sex because they cannot see the feminine qualities in their own wife, or the sexual attraction of their hard working husband.
Japanese men love their companies; they live for work, and many don’t even think it is a problem if they don’t have sex with their wives. They have pornography and the sex industry (soap lands, cabaret bars, and dial-a-girl services, and trips to Taiwan) to take care of their needs, but their wives have nowhere to go. They just suffer in silence.. or do they? The divorce rate in Japan has nearly doubled in the past 10 years, with more women blaming their sexually inactive, as opposed to sexually errant, husbands for break-ups. Though they may not be seeking sexual pleasure from their better halves, married Japanese women are seeking intimacy from other sources, leading double lives – being the good mother, while at the same time seeking out “Leroy” the lover, who is always lurking, and ready to fulfill her every desire.
Japan is full of temptation, and it doesn’t matter whether you are a housewife or salary-man, there is plenty of raunchy action waiting out there – if that is what you desire. Furin sites to find a (extra marital) “sex friend” partner are just as rampant in Japan as in other countries, however they are much more widely used by women in Japan to solve their sexless quandaries. For the more conservative ladies, sites like mixi.jp – which are neutrally classed as “social networking” spaces – are abound with profiles (men and women) looking for partners to secretly spruce up their sexless, but otherwise happily married lives.
Many Japanese marriages may be sexless, but this is only a statistic about the state of sex within marriage itself. In fact, there may be a good reason for the sexless condition of marriages here – Are the Japanese getting enough of the good stuff outside their marriages to keep them happy? I certainly think so.
Japanese people will never be sexless as individuals; therefore Japan is not sexless, so don’t let mere statistics confuse the situation!
(If you are married in Japan, or married to a Japanese, let us know what you think of “Sexless Japan” by leaving a comment below!)
Fun article! Im curious as to how many times the word “sex” and its derivatives were used
I especially liked the fact that the govt was able to correlate the reduced frequency of sex with the declining birth rate….amazing insight!
Also curious to see a pie chart on those that have sex but not with their spouse!…or one including “self amusement”
I know plenty of foreign men who don’t have Japanese wives, but who have ‘had’ Japanese wives…. The real lonely housewives of Japan are throwing themselves at any willing piece of meat.
Yet every foreign women I know in Japan has given up mostly or completely on cold fish unresponsive Japanese men.
I think there are more and deeper psychological reasons for sexless couples in Japan than this article mentions, with the main issues centering in the men. From what I gather from all my discussions and readings, the (stereo?)typical Japanese man is shy, embarrassed, timid, and doubtful about sex. Their impotence causing low self-esteem turns them to the comfortable and non-demanding fulfillment of porn, hostess bars, etc. thus leaving the door wide open for all the eager single men to whisk their willing wives away for salacious romps.
Japanese men need to stand up and get some balls, then take those balls on home instead of leaving them at work or the hostess bar.
Mmmm, an interesting debate. I’m engaged myself to a Japanese women, but admittedly we have a somewhat lack-luster love life. I’m an American myself, and tend to find the bed-side of a relationship just as important as the emotional side. This time around though, having been with this women for two years, with a bit of distance (she is in Osaka, I was in Akita, now Tokyo) really helped the emotional side develop while the physical side sort of went stale. I’ve had my share of sleepless and frustrated nights with it, and have had the occasional why the hell am I getting married thoughts, as well told the same… but for me, the emotional support truly covers all boundaries and I do think of her as a best friend, thusly I don’t worry about the lack of sex as much. But… I can see why Japanese men cheat, and why there is such an abundance of extra-marital affairs. Almost to the point that it’s accepted as going to happen. The mother-in-law-to-be has even gone so far to say, as long as you don’t go to fuuzoku, it’s acceptable…. Unfortunately the next thing that pops up in my mind is, if it’s ok for me, it’s ok for her…. for as sexless as they say the country might be, people are getting their jazz on elsewhere.. For as conservative as this country supposedly is, they have some pretty hard double standards to get used to.
Robert, funny you mention the “as long as you dont go to fuzoku” thing! I got exactly the same thing from my mother in law. It is exactly like that all women of one generation ago actually expect their husbands to have affairs outside of marriage. It’s really kind of weird hey. I must admit, that I have thought (and had the opportunity) a few times to have some extra-marital fun. When my wife rolls over and says she’s not in the mood for the third week in a row, what else do these girls expect us to do? If they don’t do what we need as men, sometime or another, their will be a need for external procurement, no? I dont think this whole idea is Japan specific either – as many of my friends without Japanese wives experience the same thing!
To continue this discussion a little farther, I recalled a couple of shows that had discussed this.
One was one of the crappier variety specials, which was on I think this last summer. Basically they were comparing percentages and trying to guess which would have a higher percentage. We’re talking banal stuff like, which is higher, the percentage of nurses who marry patients or the percentage of nurses who marry doctors. That sort of stuff. The stuff about extra-marital affairs was interested, in which they said something along the lines of 3 out of 4 couples have extra-marital relations. Interestingly enough, 2 out of 3 OL’s supposedly have intra-company affairs. Anyways, typical Japanese variety crap, but they at least had surveyed a large enough amount of people to be statistically sound.
Show two, which I’m sure some of you have seen, the Sunday night law show at 9 on Ni Tele (I think) with Shinsuke and the Lawyers turned Talent. Usually it has the humdrum shtick of I want a divorce crap, but usually shinsuke talks with the guests and goes ero-kei all the time. One time they had a couple on, don’t remember who, and they had been married for 20 or so years. The husband blatantly said he sleeps around, and has fun. The wife says? It’s ok if the body plays because the heart belongs to me only. Everyone just laughs and all is good.
Lastly, another observation that a website I used to read had posted.
Not my words, but I sure as hell understand where he’s coming from…
When you stop to think about this as well, marriage here in this country is considered something you simply have to do, it’s to have a family, some sort of stable life and kids and continue the line. But you don’t have to take it seriously, you can sleep around, because that’s part of the socially acceptable norm. Flings and sexing around here is borderline “you can’t talk about it or do it” and no one is blatant about it, but everyone is doing it.
It’s actually things like this that make me realize that Japanese people, for all that they are xenophobic, holier-than-thou, conservative, and image conscious, are simply no better than other societies that they think they are.
Yet here I am getting living and working in this country, eventually getting married to a Japanese as well. Is it because deep down I like this constriction? Constricted yet in unbelievable areas full of freedom?
What do you all think?
As a side note, I have lived in Japan for 3 and a half years, but have been studying Japanese and involved with related things for 6 years now.
EDITED by Blue: Robert, I made the quote visable as a quote to differentiate it from your writing. Thanks for the insights!
Yep, heard the “don’t go to sex parlours please” story from a friend who had that from his mum in law. Wow. Though my wife said that one of the neighbours wives doesn’t care if her hubby heads out as at least he is not falling in love! Double wow!
In my humble and not very Christian opinion, I find marriage is a fairly difficult concept to get around. I am happy enough but really suffer under the burden of only being able to look and not touch.
Sex with one partner for the rest of my life is a concept I really find hard to live with in my early 30’s (I may be okay when I hit 50 as things slow down on me). Okay if you made the “perfect” choice, but how many people do you know who have that perfect marriage anywhere on this planet? I know very few that do. At least very few who are not just plain boring people. In fact stats will tell you that 50% end in divorce, so I assume another 25% live on the verge, another 20% like me have ups and downs and the other 5% are the ones described above and those who found that perfect match.
Even with the kids that make marriage so “comlete”, both sides (he and she, though he more than she) have major temptations to go find a bit of nooky on the side. I do/did – I may have stopped that… arrrgh, burden it all seems!
But come on! Sounds like the lads on this post are married to women who have an entirely different culture, language and lifestyle to ourselves. Do we expect to find that perfect harmony and have a perfect sexless marriage? Not really I expect and I’ll take the bumps along the way, even if that means not getting laid with my wife as often as I’d wish. Though I just long for something different (and I know I am not the same).
Even the same-culture marriages in the article reflect the same inevitable urges in their non-Christian way of life. We, like our Japanese counterparts, can easily end up the same. There is danger here that people start to believe that EVERY Japanese wife is gagging for it from any stray guy that crosses her path. We need to work out what is urban legend and what is reality here. We all know some shocker stories but that isn’t at all the majority is it?
Anyway, as an aside from my corner, I read an article in some science magazine years ago that tried to tie a theory to the fact that many humans to break up after 6-9 months of dating. I was amazed as that fitted with my general break up point; that point when I started looking at other girls (sorry honey). It all (according to this article) came down to the time span of getting pregnant. If she ain’t getting pregnant, she will start looking for a new partner, as will he. I don’t remember which came first. Interesting theory though that made me out to be more monkey than man and explains my fiscally dangerous trips to seedy strip clubs in Roppongi (in the past, I should add). Though I digress.
Marvin,
Good post, and yes, I think you hit on one thread that does need to be addressed. That is, just because it’s blatant, doesn’t mean every Japanese woman and man is promiscious and horning to get it on. _Unfortunately_ and you have got to admit this, Japanese woman in general just don’t have a good image, I can’t tell you how many people I know think that Japanese women are easy, and that’s coming not only from foreign friends, but Japanese guy friends as well. Places like the meat markets of Roppongi do _not_ help allay this image. I actually can’t stand this image, because truth be told, I’ve never had any luck with woman like I hear other people do (a little whining perhaps? haha) and honestly that’s why I don’t tend to go to Roppongi, because it’s fiscally a waste of time, why the hell do I have to pay a 300% markup for a drink? To be honest we could go on and on about the stereotypes of Roppongi (Next Stippy article?). Anyways, the trick is not to fall into the trap of assuming that, or otherwise you’re going to have a hell of a time with any woman in this country.
Another good point is religion, which, personally, I’m not a devout anything, so I don’t quite have the moral restrictions that others might have, so for me, I’ve found it not wrong, not right, not going to hell or heaven, just a way of living and life and even if I don’t like it, it’s going to happen. I’m only in my late twenties, but I’ve found myself growing more fatalistic and cynical it seems (笑) That being said, while I spent a year of college in Japan, a majority of my education was in good old USA, and even being born and raised Oklahoman, and having gone to a bible belt college, I spent more of my share of weekend nights sleeping in the floor lounge because my christian roomie had “company”
As for the strip bars, and other bars of lesser repute, I will admit, there is sort of the desire to go and see what it’s about. I mean it’s not something I found regularly back home, so there is a curiousity factor, but to be honest, it costs enough to get by, live, and occassionally go out with friends, that I can’t see how people can afford to drop 1~5 man on those “services” for just a few hours or a night. Hell, just wining and dining a regular woman costs too much in this country… (either that or I need a better job!)
Pretty busy at the office today but there are loads of weird things around Japan that make life interesting and you don’t figure out even after years of living here.
Watching a drag queen on telly late last night I suddenly “clicked” and realized why there may be so many drags making their way up the tarento career track. Far more on TV here than back home in my conservative home nation.
The reason (according to my 11pm theory): Kabuki! Work that one out. Pretty simple I reckon.
PS: Yeah, the Pong is a bad trap. Been caught myself there many a time. Still, again, lots of meat market bars back home! Great fun back in the day. Now I’m married and sexless.
Haha, not busy enough at my office for me on my end, for me to be able to get away with write such long ripostes.
Japanese television itself is a phenomenom that is unexplainable, and goes to show you why some things are so screwy in this country I guess. I kinda envy the foriegn talents who make it on, but then again, most of them are their for show and exploited or stereotyped until the fad passes, so ehh. Basically though, if you’ve got enough money, or a stupid enough gimmick you can get on TV easy it seems.
But not to derail the discussion.
Japan is quite an anomaly. They make up almost half of the worlds most shocking and “out there” material (getting kicked in the groin fetish, anyone?), yet are very sexless.
Seeing as Tokyo is the highest populated city, it’s understandable that citizens would be so busy and stressed.
I, being a very non-sexual person, understand what the mean when they say they see their partner as a close friend or family member. They might feel that their emotional connection is fine, so they really might not think too much about a sexual connection.
This is really an intruiging article! More for us Japanophiles to ponder over, I guess.
What a sweet talker you are, Trevor. I have 50 women with bitch slaps in hand waiting for you:
“If they don’t do what we need as men, sometime or another, their will be a need for external procurement, no?” – Trevor
I think I’ve actually stopped talking to friends because they thought it would be funny to show some of Japanese more disgusting fetishes to me and others. Ah college days.
Ahem, Japan is quite an anomaly indeed. I’ve got my own theory, which I’m sure someone said or explained while I was studying Japanese anthropology here in college, but I really believe that this is true to an extension of their conformist society. Think about it, starting in school from an early age we start going group mentality, and once Junior High is hit, it’s pretty much hammered into them, conform, be homogenic, don’t be an individual. From there, an average Japanese person’s only out is their hobby, which, this is generalistic, consists of usually whatever 部活動 (club life) they decide to do. For those who don’t do the club, they tend to find one thing and throw themselves into it. From here is where I think Japanese start to differ from westerners in a way because they seriously, seriously throw themselves into it. Thusly we have anime otaku, game otaku, soccer otaku, train otaku, etc. It gets scary in a way how serious that some people can get. Which, personally, I’ve found makes it harder to try some club life and hobbies at times in this country, Japanese are not one for casual trial’s at times. Anyways, to go onto a tangent, this extends into the adult industry with really really weird fetishes and so-called “mania” Perhaps then finding a way to watch this or go out and fulfill this desire elsewhere keeps things at home happy, because heaven forbid if your wife knew you wanted her to walk around in no underwear in a school girl outfit in public flashing people, or some fetish worse then that. Anyways, I think this is why you can see a totally balanced person at work or school or seems absolutely wonderful, but they have this one thing that they concentrate, get good at, be obsessed with that totally (hopefully) helps them relieve stress. Anyways.. went off on a tangent. That and writing helps me pass time at work, hah.
In a way I’ve sort of realized then why you see men and women look for something new, something to break the hum-drum life of work, go home, do family duties, sleep, rinse and repeat. I myself have a commute of an hour to work (I really need to move into Tokyo) and lately I wish I had something to do or someone to talk to on the train. The wife-to-be is busy working her own job and so mail to her doesn’t really happen so often lately, because she tends to work later then me or be busy with her family.
As for Trevor’s quote
“If they don’t do what we need as men, sometime or another, their will be a need for external procurement, no?” – Trevor
This goes both ways, as it seems to be pretty obvious that some married women are apparently looking outside the home for something other then the emotional support. I wouldn’t have quite worded it that way though.
In a way, Japan is no worse then America or any other westernized country, people will sleep around, cheat, rationalize, and do their own thing. People are just afraid to respect opinions I guess. Just because someone has a mistress or sefure doesn’t mean they are a bad person.
Who knows though, for the time being it makes for great discussion and passing of time at work.
I am very sexless also so Im a bit confused about this article…sometimes I dont even care about the sex/gender of scrubbers I pick up in clubs
Thanks for all the comments people, keep them rolling in. This is one area that I would like more people’s perspective on, as it is kind of hard to ask those around you in your everyday life.
Taxman, you need a careful look at your own sexual preferences before worrying about others’ sexlessness… But please, you go ahead and keep picking up the scrubbers with a bulge down one of their legs and then we will never cross each other’s paths in or around the Roppongi Heartland!
It’s funny that some of you hear the “as long as you don’t go to fuzoku”. I get just the opposite from the wife and mother-in-law. I was actually told by the wife that if I had the urge for some strange, she’d rather have me messing around with a woman that I am paying for, rather a woman that I might develop feelings for. As for me, I enjoy sex with my wife. We have, at least I think so, a pretty adequate sexual relationship. 2-3 time s a week isn’t too shabby. Is it? As for me, I would love to have more. Just not with her. I do very much Love my wife but I would like to go dipping into something different once in a while. I on the other hand, would rather have a furin, than pay for a pro. As bad as this sounds I believe it is safer to find another married woman as a (temporary) lover because both of you have the same thing to loose. I do have married friends that are out and about beating around any bush they can find. I still have yet to act upon my hunger for another but the thought and temptation is always there.
Imagine that, being married for reasons other than slavery to sexual inclination!
Awwww darn, their culture isn’t churning out wage/sex slaves in record numbers, poor multi nationals.
How dare they treat sexual desire like any other consequence of being hairless apes? Slake it safely and move on, kinda like our built in desire to crush enemy skulls with jaw bones and severed limbs.
Less children means more individual attention per child, and on every level that’s a good thing. Japan is taking the opinion that quality trumps quantity when it comes to people, and I couldn’t agree more. There are other species that that the view that more=better ants, bees, fish, are you seeing a pattern?
It’s an adult culture with a clear vision of the capabilities of technology. Thus they see sex much like they see eating, a relic of or biological imperatives. Sure they have a problem, who dosent, but they clearly realize that doing things the old way is not a solution.
This is a teething event, and a problem I hope to one day see in America. But honestly I’m thinking we might not survive into national adulthood. To attack Japanese culture as some do because of this tiny hiccup is short-sighted without rational justification, and totally the typical behavior of the average American.
In short, this is a non problem and its short-term to a thinking man. Yea they’ll have a problem when the leftovers of previous fuck happy generations start needing their bedpan changed, but in time the new trend and numbers will balance out. These people survived and thrived despite nuclear attack, they live in the middle of the ocean, which isn’t exactly known for its uneventful weather, on a tiny island.
Color me crazy but I think they can handle a surplus of old people.
Interesting story, and even more interesting comments.
I would like to add two things: 1) the birth rate has fallen all over the world in first-world countries. Population growth verges between flat (avg. 2 kids per couple) or below replacement (
Good stuff,
Married a Japanese woman about a year and a half ago(together for 4) and man she wants action. We live in SF and I want to move to Japan(she is from Shinjuku(tokyo)) and learn japanese woodworking. My wife will have none of it-we will move to kansas(my family home) before Japan. I have to say Keiko is the best woman I have ever had-I tell I my friends marry a Japanese woman-You will be happy. That being said she won’t deal with my shit, she is just much more sanguine about it all and I love that.
Great blog and I will return to read please keep it up so I can keep reading-I might even show the wife.
Great comments, I have been with my girlfriend here in Japan for nearly 5 years. Of course that means that the marriage pressure is on because she is fastly approaching 25. She has the old thinking that you have to get married by 25 or considered worthless goods. This goes along with the Japanese concept of the Christmas cake, after the 25th, it is garbage. That being said, I am fearful of marriage. Right now we are very sexually active with each other and I have heard so many stories of men marrying Japanese women and then the sex slowly begins to disappear. She has told me about friends who are boyfriend/girlfriend and have already given up having sex. Is marriage going to be that bad? In that case, I want to be unmarried for the rest of my life.
How to deal with a Japanese wife 101 FAQ
(Circa May 26, 2000)
INTRODUCTION
This is a working draft version of the FAQ and has been concocted from various postings on fj.life.in-japan.
Read this FAQ before you go and get romantically/sexually/maritally involved with the female of the species Japanicus Autocentricus, thereby morphing yourself into Husbandus Superfluous.
* * *
I’m going to give you some advice that I wish I had gotten 11 years ago when I married a demure pretty Japanese wife who turned into a genderless piece of a dictative authority figure soon after marriage.
1.1 IS SHE FOR REAL?
Now you asked if she’s for real. Yeah, she’s certainly for real. A marriage for many Japanese isn’t about love. That’s just an Orwellian word that sounds better than the reality. One reality is that she expected to marry a guy just like her pussy-whipped father. The other reality, and the one that finds her living with you in the states, is that she got married to you because of her school girl fantasies of living as a spoiled housewife in a big house in an American suburb with some faceless foreign husband who alternated between Tom Cruise for cute and Harrison Ford for masculinity are not part of the reality she finds herself in.
1.2 LOGIC?
The first rule when dealing with a stereotypical Japanese woman is to throw logic out of the window. The use of Reason alone will get you nowhere my friend! But reason is not the same as communication, so go ahead and talk, rant, tell her how you feel. Just don’t expect any changes right away, because you’re dealing with emotions here and you’re just planting seeds.
Tell her you’ll accomodate and support her in a Japanese way, but that since she decided to marry an American, she has to come halfway to your side, too.
Every marriage comes with a 20 year marital torture guarantee. Don’t think you’re getting out of it. Your ancestors did it for you, now it’s your turn.
1.3 HAVING IT BOTH WAYS
Problem was this… her personality seemed to be very different on her home turf, with her own language. She became testy, sometimes abrasive, and dare I say it, cold and distant.
You might not realize it, but she’s trying to have it both ways: the freedom and individuality of living in America, while simultaneously being treated as a traditional Japanese woman. You need to expose this double standard to her.
2.0 PREGNANCY
Pregnancy has a profound effect on most women’s personality, and things don’t automatically revert to the way they were after birth. You can not fight mother nature, but you can finesse her. The popular myth of course is that cheating men cause marriages to fail, but I think we know this is a load of bull (hint: 2.6 times per week, ladies, and your man will not stray!). So don’t get all guilty.
3.0 WHY PEOPLE DO IT
b) stick it out and try to right the marriage ship. Sounds good on paper, but my hunch is that I’m in for 20 years-plus of absolute marital torture. (I’m not even 30 yet).
I think that a lot of women get married so that they can take you off the market and then get what they really want, which is a baby. Once they have the sprog, the husband then becomes a cash machine and little more. A lot of men, due to what they may feel are chivalrous (or religious) obligations, will try to make this nonsense work and that is what the wife counts on.
Sucker! She already has what she wants, a baby. Then she denies you what you want, which is emotional support, affection and sex. “Oh, you’re always thinking of sex” is something they will throw at you to try to make you feel ashamed.
“There’s more to marriage then just sex.” Horseshit. If there is no sexual attraction, affection or emotional connection, what you are living with is a friend.
Men don’t want to marry “just friends.” And now that she has just become your friend, she is treating you like crap. If a friend to whom you didn’t have a legal contract (marriage certificate) treated you like crap, you would say, “on your bike, mate.” So why put up with it from your wife? And you wouldn’t pay your friend’s bills, right? She is already saying, by being a slob, that she doesn’t care if you walked off a bridge tomorrow. You’re going to accept that? Are you that pussywhipped?
You also didn’t want a kid. Look, I know you like your daughter. That is only natural.
But you have to leave your wife and if you hold on to the child, it will always be a point of contention between you guys and it will give her an excuse to play games with you. And the child will feel perpetually guilty if she sees you two quarreling over her all the time. Moreover, this is complicated by the fact that you guys are straddling two nationalities.
4.0 BOYS BE AMBITIOUS
Be selfish, son. It’s your life. Life is short, so make the best of it. Jettison the bullshit (your wife) and find someone who will appreciate you (given the Draconian divorce laws in California, though, I would recommend that you avoid getting married again. There is nothing in it for men at all). And with your next mate, tell her what it is you expect and if she doesn’t like it then walk.
5.0 READ THE FAQ
I *hope* the guy isn’t really going through that hell…but this is a horrible case of “not reading the FAQ” before he went and got romantically/sexually/maritally involved with the female of the species Japanicus Autocentricus, thereby morphing himself into Husbandus Superfluous.
Fellas, this is why our daddies try (in vain) to tell us to keep it in our pants. Remember: If you can’t keep it there yourself, you run the danger of ending up married to somebody who will keep it there for you.
6.0 PARENTS
No, I am quite certain that there really are such men with such problems, because I have met such men, even just in Fukuyama. One was a Brit withone daughter. One was an American, with one girl and one boy, IIRC, and the other was a Canadian who was married recently and followed his wife to Japan, who got past the honeymoon stage in a hurry.
In every case, the women were living either with their parents (wife of Brit), or in the same town (other two). Guess who the parents sided with, no matter who seemed to be at fault?
7.0 MONEY
The Brit’s wife held down a good steady full time job despite being married with child, and made no secret she did not need her husband for support. The American’s former wife (who also revealed her belief woman should stay at home and watch TV while husband worked and also earned an MBA, after they were married) relied on her parents. The Canadian’s wife, a government worker, simply went back home one day and cut off communication with her husband, who seems to be totally in the dark about what the whole thing is about, and was threatened with police and legal action if he tried to go to the house again or refused divorce.
8.0 EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
I don’t know many Western men married to Japanese women around here, but the batting average does not seem to be good.
9.0 WHO ME WORRY?
Let’s expose this situation for what it is… a total SHAM!
It’s not a sham. Your wife walked into marriage with expectations that you would head off to work in the morning, come back late in the evening with your paycheck in hand and be too tired to do anything except go to sleep in your own futon without making a whole lotta racket.
That is marriage, son. It’s marriage in the US, it’s marriage in the UK, it’s marriage in Japan. It’s probably even marriage in Bumfucked Peking. Women have expectations that go something like “We’ll have a romantic honeymoon in Hawaii, and then I’ll have lots of time to spend at home watching Leave it to Beaver re-runs or maybe Hollywood squares if she’s already seen the episode where the Beaver gets a paper route to pay for the bicycle in the window.
Marriage is not a romantic stroll on the beach. It’s a non-stop boring routine that isn’t helped by the addition of a kid or three. You’ve got responsibilities. So does she. Her responsibilities revolve around your child/children. You no longer count as anything more than a paycheck and an extra plate of food on the table. If you want to have wild and sweaty sex, get a girlfriend. You’re married and that kinda stuff went out the window when the kid showed up.
10.0 I THINK I’M TURNING JAPANESE
It’s not just you, me, Japanese men, American men, Chinese, Russian or Nigerian men. All of us guys, no matter where we find ourselves, jumped into the sack of marriage with a lusty little demure girl and woke up with duplicates of our mother-in-laws.
Our wives didn’t get a much better deal. They married a well educated(i.e. paycheck) and a romantic guy that didn’t fart at the dinner table. They ended up with duplicates of their disgusting father-in-laws who fart at the table, fart in bed, aren’t interested in romance anymore, and never wash their feet.
I told you before that if you have expectations, then sit her down and explain to her how things are going to be. She should have done the same thing to you, so I guess both are at fault. It’s kinda late now that you have a child, but I don’t really believe she’s asking so much from you. Your traditional role in a marriage is to provide the money and security. Hers is to make sure that the children’s diapers are clean and the beans aren’t burned. Didn’t you ever watch the Brady Bunch?
I think marry with japanese girl is very good for your future because Japanese girls is very loyalty and care and love her husband.
maybe someday I can get marry with one of girl from Japan.
Anyone japanese girl want for serious…..
hehe….
try to understand her and keep your relation.
riza22222@yahoo.co.id
All,
You’re really worrying me. The comments seem to be all completely classified into two groups:
1) Gaijin who have married Japanese and distinctly noticed their sex lives dwindle upon having married (but generally had a great sex-life while courting)
2) Randy Gaijin who haven’t actually married (although they might have dated a few) a Japanese person but have strong desire to because they’ve heard somewhere that most Japanese people are really randy, too, and so Blue’s article couldn’t possibly be right.
This is all starting to make me really believe that old saying 釣った魚には餌をやらない。 Is there anyone out there who is happily (and hornilly) married!?? I’m contemplating marriage with my long-standing Japanese partner – please help!!
Gourmet, my opinion – don’t get married to a Japanese. I would just keep her as a girlfriend if you want your sex life to continue as is. Japanese girls are like transformers, pussy whips in disguise. They transform on your wedding day, and only whip for penis when they want babies. The rest of the time is spent whipping you for money, and whipping your friends away from you.
there are so many foreigners marrying japanese girls, i bet the next generation of japan might be the cutest in the world…
guys, the whole concept of getting married is about having family. living with family members is not always romantic, it could be very stressful some time. It needs efforts from both husbands and wives, and kids too. no efforts (and it’s a countinuous one), no happy marriage!
Gourmet, this looks like more evidence to support Trevor:
“No sex, please: we’re Japanese – and married”
published earlier this month in the times. I haven’t been married long enough to give you any reliable advice, but surely it boils down to communication. If you are open and honest with your hubbie/wife from the beginning then it’s hard to say that your expectations weren’t met. Or am I just another naive gaijin who has joined the list…?
>> am I just another naive gaijin who has joined the list…?
I thought that too!
>> If you are open and honest with your hubbie/wife
And that!
I think maybe sometime if your living with family members make your stress,but some time if you far from them your feel loose them….
OK,
Having followed the comments through the rss, I notice that we’re kind of starting to lose sight of the main article. Yes, Japanese marriages are sexless, yes, us foreigners married/getting married might be experiencing that. So yes, the talk to going to fuzoku, or is is accepted to play around while married and what not is relevant, but I think we’re falling into a rut of saying “Japanese girls are great in bed, until their married, so just hit as many Japanese girls as you can, because that’s all they’re good for” and playing into building a very bad image. Think we should stop and step back a second, we’re falling into drunknanpa level comments here, and bring the level back up a notch.
That said, I was re-reading the comments, and what Drew said, about the wife and what not saying get your rocks off at fuzoku, because it’s a service, for your body not your heart. I have other friends say that, and it seems there are at least some level of the population that believes in that way of thought, that the body can play but the heart (and paycheck, for the most part) stays at home. I would have to say that the fact that there is an abundance of fuzoku, with delivery girls, and other weird abnormal things goes to say there is a demand, and that the population accepts it, even if they don’t talk about it.
However, I also agree with Drew that, _if_ I had to choose, I would rather go with the furin, or the friend with benefits, over the fuzoku, because there is a certain amount of trust to the friend with benefits, that you have then you would from fuzoku. I mean… who wants to sleep with someone who could be sleeping with three or four guys a night? The thought is absolutely chilling to me. Of course, in this day and age, you can get something from the girl next door even so…
Also, Autocentricus good faq, got a chuckle out of it, and there is quite a bit of truth to it.
Of the few girls I have spoken to on this topic, every single one said they prefer that if their man had to, then he should go to the fuzoku. Definately not furin. And the reason is that it is because a furin may start to play with the heart (even if you dont expect it), whereas the fuzoku is in, out, pay, and finished. No chance of the girl losing her mans heart to the fuzoku girl. That makes it a 100% bodily service.
Autocentricus, your post is amazing! I certainly don’t agree with everything you say, but there is much truth in it. That said, here’s something quite relevant that I posted (in desperation) to another web site (reddit.com) earlier today:
Yes, I’ve been married to a Japanese woman who I am still very much in love with. The major problem in our marriage has always been lack of intimacy. This translates into her not wanting to hold hands or hug (or return such gestures when I initiate them). This also means that she doesn’t like to kiss and has little interest in sex. Despite that, sex is sometimes good, but even with the better moments, her attitude always seems to be that it is something that I do to her rather than something we do together. In bed, she is extremely passive, happy to receive oral pleasure, for example, but almost never giving it. (When she does, it has only been at my request and it never last evena full minute before she lays her head back down and waits for me to do something.) She also seems to think of once per week as a maximum. I try so hard to please her. I know I’m not a perfect husband, but when she’s particularly unhappy with something I’ve done or haven’t done, she doesn’t tell me. In the over 10 years we’ve been married, I’ve tried to discuss these issues with her and to change my own attitudes, but I have seen no effort on her part to do the same. She seems to think that I must just adapt. When we have talked about these issues, she often justifies her attitude as stemming from her being Japanese. (For example, “Japanese don’t like to kiss,” she says.) Like many Japanese, she seems to have a fatalistic attitude, believing that we must accept the way we are. My attitude (which is no doubt related to my own cultural upbringing in the U.S.) is that there is certainly much in our personalities we can trace to culture and that when we see that, we must keep in mind and show patience, but that a cultural basis is never justufucation for not changin at all. (Slavery and segregation, after all, were major parts of American culture for a very along time, but that didn’t mean we should have jsut accepted them!) From my years living in Japan and from years of frustration with the woman I love, I am convinced that Japanese society has some of the most unhealthy attitudes toward sex and intimacy.
I said that the sex is good sometimes. Recently, I’ve come to realize that that’s mainly because if you starve someone enough, almost any food will taste good. About 2 weeks ago, as we were (or, more correctly, as I was) just beginning our same, old, predictible pattern of foreplay, I suggested something slightly different. When she balked, I said that we need to do something different at least once in a great while, she responded, “Why?”. I just said that sex gets boring if you don’t, then we returned to our usual pattern of me spending 30 minutes getting her turned on while she lies on her back with her eyes closed, then she signals that she’s ready while continuing to lie flat on her back — the only position she wants. Later, I realized that since it had been almost 3 weeks since we had had sex, I was like an starving man happy whose only food for over 10 years had been stale bread. After a few weeks with nothing at all, he can be grateful for even that same, old stale bread.
The reasons for this situation are many, and I am sure that I am not without blame, but I do think that Japanese culture is one of the primary causes, including the notion that change is not possible.
This post has gotten way too long! Obviously, we’ve got some serious problems here. I’ve spent so much time looking for books on this topic and advice on the web, but it’s very difficult to find any in English that address these problems from the standpoint of cultural backgrounds. Also, almost all advice realting to lack of sex and sex drive in marriage refers to getting your relationship back to where it used to be. Before we married and in the early years of marriage, we had the same problems, but there always seemed to be hope that things would change. Now, I don’t have much hope for the future and I’m desperate for advice. If anyone can point me toward good sources for that, I would be very much obliged.
Thanks — and sorry again for the long rambling post!
(My wife has many qualities that have led me to love her deeply, but I’m not sure how long I can continue without intimacy. I should add one other VERY important fact that will no doubt help you understand our problems: we have 4 kids. She’s a wonderful mother to them. To both of us, nothing is more important than them. She, however, also seems to think that it is not possible to make kids the #1 priority and our marriage #2. To me, she seems to think that kids are the ONLY priority and that I’m just being selfish. Uhg!)
Kakui,
I think I’m probably preaching to the converted but I read some interesting data somewhere – I just wish I could remember the source for you. It surveyed married couples in various countries about what their priorities were. I think the question was something like, if you were caught in a river close to drowning with your partner and your child, which would you save.
Apparently almost all Japanese participants announced that they would save their child whereas a lot (I can’t remember what percentage) of Westerners answered their spouse.
I think it is a difficult question because clearly there is no obvious answer and you could definitely answer that they are both wrong. I suppose what is different is this perception. ie
To Japanese there seems to be one right answer.
To Westerners there is no right answer.
It seems to have something to do with being a blood relation – what do you call it 血縁関係? There is something about family relationships in Japan which are much, much stronger than in the West. I’m not just talking about oedipus syndrome, think of how the eldest son looks after his parents – quite often more so than he does his own wife. If your wife and your own Mother had a fight – whose side would you take? That’s a tricky question again but I think that in Japan the answer is pretty obvious.
The problem with having a child (or four) is that you create more and more people in your “family” which are connected by blood to your spouse. That makes you a minority.
Kakui, is your wife close to her family? Am I right in guessing that she would side with her Dad over you in a fight. Boy, have I seen that happen before today.
I think this attitude to blood relatives is a cultural issue and will be very hard to change. If that is what she is referring to when she gives you the “it’s because I’m Japanese crap” then I think I can hear where she is coming from.
That aside, there is no reason why this has to imply that you can never have a strong bond with a complete strange (ie. you). If you don’t mind my asking, did you ever have that type of relationship? (To be honest the girls like Trevor was talking about are real mysteries to me)
In the few relationships that I have seen like that around me, the couple was very quick to have children. It is really hard to fight with your wive’s 母性本能. Unless you have spent a long time (and I think that means many years in some cases) building an extremely strong (and romantic) base to your relationship, you’re going to find that it suffers immediately once “mini me” (or should I say “mini her”) is on the scene.
Does that all sound plausible?
Wow, I unfortunately have a day job so must keep it brief. Kakui sounds like he’s married to MY wife. Amazingly similar. To try and fix things (without going the girlfriend/’ho route) I suggested to her that we get some toys and costumes and she said yes. So best I go buy them. I’ll let you know how it works out. I also suggested breast implants, which she said she wanted. So there goes 5 grand. I’ll let you know how they work out too.
Kakui, I am in the same boat as Marvin and you also. I have tried and recently succeeded in spicing up my “night” life with the wife. It just involved a few D&Ms with her about how I wasn’t feeling like a man, and I asked her if I could do anything more to help her get in the mood to, well, get in the sack. She soon saw my side of things, and all is good for now.
Seems the Koreans are also making fun of the Japanese in this article:
http://theseoultimes.com/ST/?url=/ST/db/read.php?idx=4976
I expected western media to ring this sexless Japan thing until the last drop, but when other Asian countries start, Japan has really got some thinking (and more!) to do.
Looks like the sexless issue is not only limited to Japan. Here is an article on China Daily today.
********************************************************
30% of couples abandon sex for stress
By Wu Jiao (China Daily)
Updated: 2007-04-02 06:45
With constant pressure from families and careers, a staggering 30 percent of middle-aged couples give up on sex, according to a new survey.
The survey, the first of its kind to measure intimacy between middle-aged couples in China, was conducted by American pharmaceutical manufacturer Eli Lilly Company and the Beijing-based China Population Communication Center.
Interviewing 32,906 people in 10 big cities including Beijing and Guangzhou, the poll found that middle-aged couples in the Chinese mainland seldom communicate in their daily life, and often rate their sex lives poorly.
The survey suggests that the major problems affecting marriages are lack of communication, arguments and unsatisfactory sex.
While 46 percent of respondents said they believe a satisfactory sex life promotes intimacy between couples, most couples admitted that their sex life has deteriorated since their wedding.
Around 45 percent of couples said that the husband has sexual dysfunction. Of those, 76 percent said they feel frustrated and complain about it.
Specifically, 30 percent of middle-aged couples and 25 percent of couples younger than 30 have given up sex altogether as a result of physical or psychological problems related to stress.
Many couples also said they were frustrated at the lack of day-to-day intimacy in their lives.
According to the survey, 41 percent of middle-aged couples only kiss and cuddle at home when their children are not around.
About 25 percent only want to mind their own business when they are left alone, either just talking or not communicating at all.
The older the couples are, the less likely they are to communicate or act intimately, found the survey.
Another notable finding was that family responsibilities often lead to a decrease in communication – 37 percent of respondents said pressure from concerns over their children’s education, caring for parents or finances had led to less communication with their spouse.
According to Qiu Xiaolan, an expert with the China Sexology Association, a healthy sex life and frequent day-to-day communication are the foundations for maintaining an intimate relationship between husband and wife.
A decline in sex will lead to a decrease in communication and adversely affect the relationship, said Qiu.
“Due to the heavy burden having a family and a career puts on middle aged people today, sexual dysfunction is affecting more and more middle-aged men, overshadowing their relationship with their wives and undermining the stability of the family,” said Qiu.
Perhaps they should consider renaming it the China Once-in Every-Few-Monthsly?
Dammit these alerts suck me in all too often… popped in to say:
“Uh oh lads… check this out: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601101&sid=alJHtBVJQRgY&refer=japan“
Hey Marvin,
That is OLD NEWS on stippy. We wrote about that one months ago!
Yeah, I feel like I’m in a time warp sometimes. Sorry. I’ll improve my game.
Gourmet in Washington, you make some good points. I should underscore, however, that these issues were present even before we had kids. She always had a reason why this was not the moment — you know, the usual: I’m really tired, I have a headache, . . . . Before kids, during the first year and a half of our marriage, she was working a lot of hours at a tough job, but so was I! We were both stressed out at times, but she always seemed to view sex as another chore, another duty that added additional stress rather than something we do together that helps reduce stress (among other benefits). She hasn’t changed in that regard, and kids have, of course, made things even harder.
Who do you save from drowning, your spouse or your kids? Well, I’m a Westerner, but I would have to say the kids — no doubt about it. I have always felt that way. I don’t say that because of the problems between my wife and me, and I am glad that she also would not hesitate to choose the kids. But I should add that she is very close to her mother, and I’m not so sure if she would choose to save me before saving her mom — despite the fact that her mom’s got 24 years on me! I love my mother very, very much, but I would choose my wife over my mom if faced with such a situation.
Marvin & Jim, I feel for you guys, of course. I’ve tried spicing up our sex life, and it seemed to work a bit at times, but then we too easily fell back into the same situation. She’s not into costumes, but I’ve introduced toys, which she seemed to enjoy, but again, she always just laid back and let me do something to her. They never resulted in any real change, and they came with her usual list of “don’ts” and “can’ts (e.g. Don’t touch my breasts – I don’t like that. Don’t expect me to roll over. I can’t do anything to you – too tired or I just don’t want to.). We’ve also views some carefully selected porn together, which seemed to get her turned on a bit, but she still just laid there. A couple years ago, in an act of desperation, I even suggested we go to what was supposed to a very nice, on-premises swing club. I wasn’t suggesting swinging — and, supposedly, many of the couples at this club are only there to see and be seen — but I thought if she saw what other couples do together, it might encourage her to relax. (Previously, when we had been talking about love hotels back in Japan, she mentioned that in recent years — since we left Japan — love hotels where you can see other couples were becoming more popular. She said she’d be interested in visiting one together.) She was open to going to the club and suggested that I check out the certain dates. I did, but nothing was good anytime very soon. After a few weeks, when I came back to the idea and tried to schedule it again, she was totally negative about it. Okay, maybe it was a dumb idea, but I was — and am — desperate.
She’s hinted that I might follow the example the example of the husband (American) of a good friend of hers (Japanese). As far as we can tell, their marriage is totally or almost totally sexless — at least betweent he two of them. The friend’s husband is always mentioning to me strip clubs here in America and his visits to Bangkok. But it’s my wife I want. It’s her I love. I’ve told her that again and again and again.
Some great comments here. It really is a deep subject, and something that I dont think we will find a solution for soon. But it is still fun seeing people’s views and opinions. There is another good thread on this at gaijinbot:
http://www.gaijinpot.com/bb/showthread.php?t=3170
Yeah, some interesting comments on that site too.
I gotta admit, it sounds like I have it pretty good after all. At least in my case it is ME, not my wife who slows our sex life down. I just need some “strange”. Same old, same old. That gets old. For both he and she. Also, I don’t buy into this “Japanese only” crap, I have friends back home who are pretty similar and don’t shag so often. You just get bored with the same old rituals, same old tools.
Everyone needs a change now and then, it is basic human hormonal nature, the way God made us or however you wanna put it. Speaking of which, we need some God freaks on this thread to spice up the conversation!
Do married Christians have sex? What about married Japanese Christians then?
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My girl caught me looking at this thread and the gaijinpot thread (actually I left it up and she used the computer the next morning) and she asked me if it is something I was worried about. We’re not sexless (not married either) but there has definitely been a tapering off.
Well, we had sex twice that night, with renewed passion. So an answer to all you sexless guys out there… let her catch you looking at this thread (or the gaijin pot thread). It will work better than direct confrontation.
Let me know if this works for anyone else.
Interesting advice Kuri. I was actually preparing to try out the chocolate test…
Kuri, my girl caught me writing the damn thing.. She didn’t ask me anything..
>Marvin
>Do married Christians have sex? What about married Japanese Christians then?
Good questions — I guess! My wife (Japanese) and I (American) are both Christians, but I don’t think religion has anything to do with it. Indeed, the ideal marriage as laid it in most Christian theology with which I’m familiar, emphasizes the union of two souls. The brand of Christianity that we practice encourages couples to express their love for each other in various ways, including in the bedroom. However, she became a Christian only three years ago and has not paid any attention to such ideas. Whatever the source — from Christianity, sociology, philosophy, or simple advice columns — she tends to dismiss any notions that don’t conform to her own preconceived ideas. She thinks that I’m just expecting her to be an American woman. I’ve tried hard to make sure that that’s not what I’m asking of her, but fearing that she could have a point in at least a few instances, I’ve read and tried to learn whatever I can about universal ideas of love, intimacy and sex. I’ve purposely tried to find notions that would contradict my own thinking and challenge me to change. The more I do that, however, the more I’m led to the conclusion that Japan has an unusually high number of people with very unhealthy attitudes toward marriage and that I’m married to one of them.
I do not – or , at least, I know that I must not – expect that my wife will ever completely conform to what I believe, but I do expect that her to try to learn and understand as best she can what love is and how humans express it. She told me six months or so ago that she’s not so sure that she understands what love is, and therefore can’t be sure how much she loves me. My response was to try harder to learn more and understand better issues of love, marriage, intimacy and sex and to encourage her to do the same. She’s just not interested. I know, she’s working full time and we have 4 kids, so it’s awfully tough to find the time or energy, so I’ve really, really, really tried to lower my expectations, hoping only that there would be at least some little sign that she was trying at least a little bit. I’ve also been trying hard to make sure that I’m doing more around the house, taking more responsibility for the kids, etc. I’ve tried to talk to myself, to soothe myself and not to get angry or show frustration. I’ve tried to be as sweet and loving as I can be. I give her massages (which she loves). I tell her how beautiful she is. I tell her how much I love her. Her response: nothing.
About 2 months ago, reaching what seemed to be a crisis point, I stopped the massages and the words of love. I also tried my best to be polite and to just treat her the same way she treats me. At the same time, I also redoubled my efforts to take care of housework and kids. That didn’t work either. In fact, she just starting telling her friend how she had recently discovered some negative aspects of me that she hadn’t known before. So, about a month ago, I went back to trying to be more understanding and to treat her in a loving way. Now, she’s happier with me again, but she is still making no efforts In fact, we’re having even less sex!
I – rather, we – really need help. I just wish that she knew that.
Addendum:
One of the big problems, it seems, is that a lot of Japanese don’t view learning as something you do your entire life. My wife seems to think that by the time she was 23 years old, she was completely formed. That seems to be her attitude with almost everything.
A friend asked me how he could spice up his sex life with his girlfriend last year. I told him he should do cos-play and dress up as Buzz Lightyear. He took me seriously the fool. They broke up at Xmas.
Kakui, maybe you need to do the spicy thing. But hey with 4 kids!!! How can you get time? We have kids too but when they are asleep, I want to get the mrs all decked out in the suspenders, stockings and heels, school girl uniform and the likes and have my wicked ways. yeaaaah! Beats spanking off to the computer.
Has your wife ever busted you doing that? Ouch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OraQHpHvB3I
this is NEVER my problem! and i always laugh when i hear it from others, gaijin and japanese alike.
1) i set the stage by telling all the girls that i think i may have sex with that in all my relationships i have sex 3 – 5 times a week.
2) i learned the culinary art of cunnilingus. which means i can almost quarantee she’ll cum first. trust me, when she cums in that way she’s ‘addicted’ to me.
cunnilingus, you can’t rush it, count on minimum face time of 15 – 20 minutes. technique is important, try to think of savoring a juicy steak or licking an ice cream cone, not swallowing bad tasting medicine.
few men have that skill, learn it and i promise she’ll be asking to cum back
i think that the reason i’ve stumbled along so well as i have, is that giving a woman pleasure has always been my goal. women tell me i’m good, they voluntarily tell me, i’ve never asked,”was it good?” and i’ve figured out enough about the female anatomy where it’s hard to fake an orgasm with me. my very first lay out of highschool(i was a virgin ’till 18 but almost a freight train every since)was an older woman who had been chasing me who absolutely didn’t believe i was a virgin.
with my girl now we have sex sex 2 – 3 times everytime we meet, twice a week. my goal has always been to exhaust women, put them to sleep through body shattering, convulsive orgasms. i do this through oral sex, not cock insertion. which means they cum first, that is my goal. after i cum, they are surprised when i tell them i’m not tired. i smile sometimes as they can barely keep their eyes open as they play with their hair and smile at me. believe me there is nothing like the look of satisfied woman that has just cum sleeping next to you! heck i’m damn near getting a hardon just thinking about it. when a girl tells you her pussy “feels like indonesia” when she thinks about you at work, yeah, you are doing something right!
true story: in the states my mom came into my apartment to leave something for me(i wasn’t there) and she heard one of my girls leaving a message for me. later my mother asked me, “what are you doing to these girls? you better watch yourself! what, you think you invented sex!?” my response, “no mom, i didn’t invent it. girls just didn’t enjoy it before me! ha hah ha” my mother threw her shoe at me.
get a girl to cum consistently and you can have all the sex you want from her. it is truly a drug for them, because generally men do not care enough. my sex life is great because i know that hands down i’m one of the best lays on earth, this is not conceit, i work at it, i just truly really love giving pleasure.
Mitaboy: “i know that hands down i’m one of the best lays on earth”
Who knows….you might be, but that doesn’t mean you aren’t a complete tosser! Grow up mate – you sound like an 18-year-old.
Having sex is like learning a language – the moment you thing you are getting OK at it, someone comes along who shows you just how much better you can be.
Except of course if you are Mitaboy who seems to have peaked already….
All this is only just on topic though isn’t it….somehow I think that there could be deeper social issues behind this than just the willingness to go down?
“one of the best” means that there are others that are better. satisfy your woman and your sex life will improve, period.
that doesn’t ignore the other aspects of a relationship, but if she isn’t really satified sexually there isn’t any real inducement to have sex with you is there?
Mitaboy – If that’s what you wanted to say in your post you probably could have done it without comments like:
“this is NEVER my problem! and i always laugh when i hear it from others, gaijin and japanese alike”
There may be people out there reading this who are actually in one of the relationships described in the article, and would like some intellingent discussion on the issue rather having it implied that it’s all their fault because they are $hit in the sack???
You also seem to be missing the other side of the equation when you say “if she isn’t really satified sexually there isn’t any real inducement to have sex with you”.
This is implying that women are only interested in sex for their own pleasure, and to be quite honest, is a pretty derogatory comment. Thankfully the women I know are not as shallow and superficial as yourself.
please read: “that doesn’t ignore the other aspects of a relationship” this means that there other aspects to be considered, other than sex. i’m not suggesting that it’s only sex
however when men speak of trying to or meeting women’s other “needs” in many cases a woman sexual satisfaction isn’t given enough attention.
many men have stated how they try to accommodate their lover’s or wives needs that are in no way related to sex yet their sexual desires(the men’s) are met. some men feel that sex is like a reward, it isn’t a reward. approach sex from her perspective of satisfaction and having enough sex is a non issue.
i stand by this “if she isn’t really satisfied sexually there isn’t any real inducement to have sex with you”. one’s lover or wife is not a call girl. call girls don’t need to be satisfied, one’s lover or wife should be.
like it or not, many men could care less about truly satisfying their lover or wife. i don’t happen to be one of them. their are enough statistical studies that bear out the fact that women are less pleased than men with sex. that is because many men have a selfish view of the act of sex itself.
So then mitaboy, what you’re saying then is, most Japanese women don’t care about sex because they haven’t been enlightened to it, by say someone as talented as you? Bold words….
How about the obvious problem of a lack of marital intimacy? My wife and I (both Canadian) have been floored by comments like “Why are you so close?” (when sitting, literally, about 6 inches apart on a couch and not touching each other at all) and “Japanese expect to grow apart throughout their married life.” The person who made that second statement declared it with a fair deal of pride. I couldn’t believe two things: 1) That decreased intimacy was the EXPECTED path for a marriage; 2) That this person was actually proud of this because they saw it as “the Japanese way.”
I’m not at all surprised that the porn, maid cafes, affairs, and consuming work culture make marital intimacy a challenge of Fuji-esque proportions.
With impending changes to the pension system, expect a huge increase in the divorce rate. The intimacy is already gone and soon the economic incentive for couples staying together will be removed as well.
to robert:
you are 100% correct! the key, “’someone’ as talented as you”, the operative word being someone, not necessarily me.
there are many men like me in the world. i’m not so special. the difference being is that i’ve studied(and continue to do so) how to please women. most men haven’t studied it, i have. there’s plenty of information out there. and basically the only men that take issue with me (i’m not saying that you are one of them) are those that aren’t sure that their women, lover’s or wives are sexually satisfied most of the time. i can say mine are. my sex life has never been an issue. that is because i think of her pleasure first. women have told me this – unsolicited and i’m experienced enough with the female anatomy to know they are telling me true.
many men think by virtue of the fact that they have a penis they can satisfy a woman, how incredulous.
Mitaboy: Still, knowing how to please a women, doesn’t exactly mean that they will let you get that far. It seems that you’re thinking that knowing how to please a women down below through the use of other then the conventional penis is what will get her fired up. While always a valid point, and I wholeheartedly agree with giving more, the problem here isn’t how you satisfy the woman, but _getting_ to be able to satisfy the woman. All your tricks won’t do you any good if she’s plain not interested, doesn’t care, or as I’ve noticed in the past, doesn’t want you to go down south. Technique’s not the problem here I think, it’s being able to use that technique or not that is the problem
robert
understood and i agree.
if she isn’t into you, she isn’t into you. if she was into you, find out why and rekindle that.
Mitaboy,
Seriously – go back and read your original post. Now have a good long think about the impression people are going to get after they read it.
1) You start by putting down people who are having problems and revel in the fact that you don’t.
2) You go on to call yourself “a freight train” and “one of the best lays on earth”
3) You suggest that “girls didn’t enjoy [sex]” before meeting you.
Then in a later post you go on to suggest that the reason people take issue with you is because of their own sexual insecurities?!? Wow.
Could it be that people take issue with you because it really doesn’t sound like you are trying to give helpful advice, you just love talking about how good you are?
Maybe that’s why your girlfriend likes it so much when you go down; its the only time that she gets a few minutes of peace and quiet.
Once you filter through all the cr@p, what you are saying is fine. But it essentially boils down to “try harder to please your partner” doesn’t it?
I completely agree, but it’s hardly groundbreaking stuff, and I’m pretty sure your message could have been made without all the self gratification.
For someone you claims to be so focused on others you really do spend a lot of time talking about yourself!
flintstone:
won’t disagree with you. that being said.
most people(51%+) that are good at something express(brag about) it at sometime.
i NEVER take bragging personally. i see through it, take as a human ‘frailty’(?), question that individual if i’m interested in what he(she) is bragging about, determine where the substance may be and utilize it.
again, generally speaking men(i’m not saying that you are one of them) get tweaked when the issue of their sexual performance may be challenged. i don’t. i listen, determine what’s applicable, learn and get better.
this applies to the non-sexual aspects of my relationships too.
Mitaboy, you “listen, determine what’s applicable, learn and get better” and “this applies to the non-sexual aspects of my relationships too”? Then listen to all the applicable advice given by others here: you’re an ass, and apply it to these relationships: stop talking so you don’t look like even more of an ass.
whew!! you took it too personally. name calling. the lowest form of human communication. you’d have done better not to vent. breathe in, breathe out.
me: not affected by your rant, maybe others will be
It is the LACK of content in your posts that we take personally. We’re affected by your posturing rants. Please offer something constructive, or stop clogging the forum.
do you mean you want technical instruction?
i’ve not read any posting that has offered any solutions, if so, please point out the posting number.
if one wants technical instruction ‘google’ it
should anyone think my posts have ‘zero’ value. contact the administrator and have them deleted.
my feelings won’t be hurt in the least
No!!! Please don’t delete them!!!
I want to come back here whenever I feel down and have another good laugh!!!
Rest assured, we don’t delete any comments on stippy, as long as they are (sort of) on topic, and are not spam. By the way Mitaboy, congratulations, you are number one on Google for a search of “mitaboy”. Nice one.
and laughter might help rekindle a relationship. scientifically proven to affect one’s attitude, which may be all that the woman in one’s life needs – a change in attitude
Might I suggest we simply ignore Mitaboy?
While he made a good point, he totally blew it in the approach, and any sort of response to that and him will get you a less the satisfactory answer.
Let’s look at it as an example of what happens when your ego grows bigger then your common sense.
Like I said though, while pleasing your partner is valid point, I still think it is not the issue here. It’s not a matter of if you go down on your wife or please her or not, it seems like a majority of the people here want to love their wife and do all the dastardly things you can do with her. It’s just… well they’re not interested, and I’ve found that continued disinterest shown leads to disinterest on the male side as well, which leads to the other methods of output (gf, fuzoku, furin, sefure, etc). I reiterate, you could be the next best thing after sliced bread in the sack, but if she just don’t care, or doesn’t want anything other then the normal missionary style, regular sex, then it’s going to be hard to show her that you’re the pb&j in her sandwich.
Ahem… if anything, I’m amazed at the wide range of extremes in the country, with women who are either in to everything, or quite serious, lights off, no touching below the breasts, and amazingly shy/embarrassed about their bodies.
If anything, the one thing I wish is that Japanese women would be a little more congenial to… trimming down below, personally…not to be crude or anything, but sometimes it’s a jungle, and that’s just as much of a turn off to men to go down below as it is for women to do it for us.
Rob,
I think I can speak for everyone on this thread when I say we hear you on the jungle downstairs problem.
Its always a sticky topic to bring up with your partner, but if you have the courage to suggest that maybe trimming it back a little might help to spice things up, then the benefits can lead to much better things in the bedroom.
offer to trim your lover yourself and be sure you’re equally as well trimmed
and by the way:
the use of “dastardly”
“it seems like a majority of the people here want to love their wife and do all the ‘dastardly’ things you can do with her. It’s just… well they’re not interested,”
if one loves his wife but considers the things he does with her as ‘dastardly’, maybe his wife senses the ‘dastardliness’ of effort?
sex shouldn’t be considered a reward for good behavior.
whatever fire that kindled her interest in you sexually before(assuming it was genuine) , go back to that, rediscover that.
Mitaboy, if you hadn’t noticed, I was trying to inject a little bit of humor in the subject. As for you advice, it seems you’ve lost what footing you’ve had in giving advice with your rather brash start and then sudden turn around of taking everything serious, so perhaps it would be best if you refrained from more comments? It doesn’t seem like people are taking them very serious anymore.
read posts 65 and 67
you must be taking me seriously as you continue to respond to ME.
and quite honestly what you or anyone else thinks of ‘me’ is quite irrelevant.
you stated(post 69, great # btw) “While he made a good point,” the astute readers will catch that and get beyond the ‘tooting of my own horn’, which everyone one does i might add, maybe you’ve never done that.
but hey, i’m lovin’ the attention you’re giving me me me ME! ha hah ha because if i’ve irritated you, you are thinking creatively about your girl and i’ve done a good thing!
For those who want to know, the word for a shaved muff in Japanese is “Paipan”. I don’t know why and I haven’t been able to find any etymology on this, but there it is. Maybe just drop the word casually in conversation, perhaps when choosing peaches at the grocery store or something, and see how the wife reacts.
Oops I guess I should have done a google/wikipedia search first.
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%83%91%E3%82%A4%E3%83%91%E3%83%B3
and as for the ladies, on top of being naturally feminine (with petite sexy bodies, skin that doesn’t seem to change complexion from childhood, pretty faces and silky black hair)
Pretty faces, that’s subjective.
Sorry, but you sound like A PEDOPHILE! Petite sexy bodies (??) and and skin that is liek a child… One of the top pictures of your homepage shows school girls legs… That’s just SICK. I knew the person who made this site must be a pervert… But in most countries people DONT find petite bodies to be sexy… Now, if Japanese women are SOO NATURALLY SEXY AND FEMININE, can you explain HOW IN HEAVEN their husbands cheat on them?? How come Americans have more sex in their couples??No you can’t, because you’re just a gaijin with yellow fever who fantasizes on women who look like 10 year old girls… People like you give a bad name to gaijin… You are no different from the racists who depict Japanese as one stereotype. There are many ugly Japanese women, but in your sick yellow fever mind, you don’t remark them because it is SO ingrained in your mind that Japanese women have superior beauty… Yes, Akiko Wada is a prime example of this Japanese superior feminity you speak of…
Ever notice how people who accuse others of racism are often racists themselves?
Yes Whatever:
But think about what you are saying. Liking girls with skin that is like a child does not mean that the author thinks children are sexy. This is a metaphorical way of saying that he likes young looking skin, something that girls universally strive for (or at least, should strive for..). How many (non-teenage) girls do you know that say “I wish I looked older”? None right? They ALL wished that they looked younger, and Japanese girls have perfected this art of making their fully mature bodies look prime.
By the way, the reason why Japanese guys cheat, may be described in the article and comments above. Did you read any of them?
Hmm.. Anyway, you obviously are not going to agree with me, so look, you can stick to your fat (sorry, *curvy*) American chicks (leave the yellow for the rest of us).
Cheating is the brute instinct of human being, and it’s not limited to Japan or Japanese husbands. Didn’t you notice that the wives also cheat on their husbands, the famous example might be Prince Charles and Diana..
[...] not tired you can continue reading: Timesonline article, a book about the sexless phenomenon and great article at Stippy.com. Sin comentarios + → ←Sex in Japan – [...]
Some of the inane comments here are really something…I can’t believe that people here were really awarded Monbusho scholarships. You all compliment Japanese women to the high heavens on their “smooth skin,” etc. and then complain when the marriage goes wrong. What did you expect??
Hi Kakui,
I too have been married to a Japanese woman for ten years. As someone pointed out your wife’s character is the mirror image of mine too!
There’s no desire to be sexually active,I’m tired of all the excuses and the inability to have any body language and to initiate sex. I can count maybe 7 times in ten years when she has been the one to make the first move on me! I have therefore pleaded with her to find out how to be romantic and how to initiate any sexual desires she may have by looking on the internet. I might get a yeah yeah which means no way! I feel stuck in loveless marriage and DO feel like a room mate!
Just tonight there was a new show “Carmen’s sexy body work out shown at 11.30pm “. At the end of it I asked her if she could remember any of the moves so we could have a relaxed atmosphere and possibly a few laughs, but once again said she couldn’t remember. When I asked her more on this she said she was too tired and that she had done my ironing today and that I should help her hang up the washing now instead of arguing!I wasn’t arguing! Merely pointing out things. Why is it that she doesn’t use the past tense to think of good memories or achievements I have done yet is good at using the past only to show me what she has done? In this marriage, I started losing my feeling of masculinity about three years ago so started feeling maybe I was wrong too show affection and that I was be expecting too much from her. Talk about a feeling of role reversal. I was quickly shown the light, when I went to Osaka universal studios, and saw many Japanese couples holding hands! Boy was I confused!! I realised that I had been brainwashed by her and that I was normal!! As someone mentioned I felt I had been starving for affection and could see it all in front of me. Granted many of these couples as my wife said weren’t married, so???
Let me just add that we have 2 great children a 7 year old and a two year old. My wife does a good job cooking and looking after them and taking them out as well as balancing helping out our company, but the problem I have realised is that the 2 year old gets all the affection and regularly wants holding and cries for mummy at night and in the morning! It dawned on me that if the 2 year old is always the center of attention then she loses respect for her 7 year old sister and for me. If I tell my wife to hug me in front of the kids she might give me a sumo king of hug and a groan but my 2 year old will RUN to hug me!!! Can’t my wife get the message? NO!
My wife used to openly criticise me in front of the kids which thankfully has stopped but she continues to sleep in the kids room. I am only in my early thirties and am often smiled at by Japanese woman when I’m on my own so why do I feel like a popular commodity which is hers but she doesn’t want to use? Does this ring a bell?
What I want is for open feelings to be shown, for my wife to stop sleeping in the kids room, and to stop being such a pessimist. When this occurs then possibly the feeling of a boring marriage will stop! But I won’t hold my breath!
Oh yes did I not mention that it’s difficult to invite friends over since my wife says she will have to clean up the place before their arrival. This sounds very Japanese!
I love my kids but have stopped wearing my wedding ring since I don’t feel so OWNED! That’s all for now,but would be happy to hear your thoughts and insights on this to help find a solution.
Al
Hi Kakui and Marvin, Seems to be a pattern emerging here? Just the same story here too… once we had kids, then all of the passion ground to a halt! 100% of the attention is to herself and the children. I don’t want all the attention, but a proportionate amount is necessary for a healthy relationship. Never (or very rarely) wants to initiate sex with me, and no longer responds to my advances (excuses, too tired, not now, Japanese are conservative…) , although took the initiative of purchasing such toys to DIY, and makes no secret of it, even asking me to assist sometimes. (this is shocking for me), but does not want to touch me. Spends up big on the beauty with facials etc, but that is normal for j-girls, and I don’t mind her looking good. …Like Marvin, my wife also has her sights set on breast implants (A to C cup), and has been seeing various cosmetic surgery centres for the past two months checking out her options. She seems a liitle worried about what people around her would think (mainly family and friends), so has been wearing seriously padded bras since she stopped breast feeding 8 months ago in order to make the transition seemless. I think that this is an unnecessary step and tried to talk her out of it. My wife won’t admit that there is a problem and at the moment I just don’t know what to do about it…, or how to set things right.
Make sure this situation doesn’t exist…
“Can you help me…I feel like I’m your slave”, she says. Words of a Japanese woman and homemaker to an American man, echoed by Japanese women to Japanese men everywhere in Japan. Whether she works outside the home or not, the Japanese woman does almost all the home-related chores, while the man, no matter what nationality, many times sits on his butt like lord and master.
In all fairness, many foreign-born men do share the housework workload, and Japanese men are slowly coming around, but the vast majority of women still have two jobs: company and home.
Among the items on her lengthy to-do list of household tasks is ‘sex with the husband’. In Japan it’s stereotypically considered one of those things that’s just part of a relationship, whether she’s sexually satisfied or not. Because his salary enables her to buy the brand bags and shoes, puts a roof over her head and food on the table, that is if she wants to get married. Sex in such a situation is nothing more than a mechanical act. Can you imagine a man having to perform such a ‘chore’ with little to no sexual satisfaction?
So, if she doesn’t seem interested or says she’s too tired try lightening her workload.
Good points mitaboy, Ah, I wish I could attribute the characteristics I described to your scenario…Unfortunately I can’t. My wife quit her work upon getting married 7 years ago, and has no intention of going back to work. She’s not overworked on housework as we have a maid (no – not akiba type maid
, but domestic assistance style maid to wash, iron, clean bathroom, vacuum the house etc.) twice a week. My wife likes to socialise with other Japanese girlfriends about twice a week at downtown (uptown) cafes as well as meet the “mothers club” at the park weekly. Surely her life is not too stressful?
mike,
sounds like she has a life better than most japanese women! she may be the envy of some.
i’ll say something, it may seem brutal, please, it isn’t meant to be. think back and assess those times that ‘you’ thought sex was good, do you think she was really interested in sex or driven by something else? she does seem to have a good life.
assuming that you still find her attractive, the only thing that i might suggest is to rediscover what it was about you that made you sexually desirable.
some people say that japanese women are sexual enjoy sex until after they have children then a ’switch’ goes off in their head. personally i haven’t found many japanese women to be sexual. though they can be trained to be sexual to some degree.
Let me start by saying great thread and great responses! I happen to agree with mitaboy on the goal of pleasuring a woman first as you main goal (with the corrollary that she should in turn want to please you!).
Ok, so I came across this thread/post/blog because I am new to the Japanese dating game and am having the same issues with the girl not being interested in sex as lots of others here are. I’m looking for answers but so far the general consensus seems to be that if I have such a girl, it is best not to take it too much further since if it’s bad now, it’s guaranteed to get 100 times worse if I ever decide to tie the knot.
I’m relieved to know I’m not the only one with these issues, anyway! What I am going to do (aside from trying a few suggestions out like cosplay etc, gently suggested to her) is actually discuss this thread with her (or attempt to – her english is ok but nowhere near the level required to understand this stuff fully) to show her that we have a common problem and aren’t unique in any way. Communication is always important and if she maybe understands that the issue is at least partly cultural then it may help. It may not, but if that turns out to be the case then I sadly may have to look elsewhere (at least she’s girlfriend only and not a wife like some here!). I really like her personality but as some have pointed out, it’s sex that gives a relationship its uniqueness – if you aren’t hving sex then really it’s no different to just being good friends, and that is NOT something I’m going to give a bigger commitment like marriage to.
Anyway, awesome thread and it’s helped a lot, so thanks for everyone’s input!
You guys may have seen this already but last week I wrote an article about pre-marital counseling in Japan.
link here
Everyone who we spoke to made it very clear that counseling shouldn’t be seen as a one-off thing. It is an investment in your marriage that should be done regularly. Even people with strong relationships revisit their counselors once every few years – hey, that is why they have strong relationships.
In the West I think pre-marital counseling is easier to bring up than post-marital as it is more widely accepted and a lot of people do it. I’m sure I’m preaching to the converted when I say that it isn’t the case in Japan and it took a lot of guts to suggest the topic to my fiance. I think it’s easy to interpret it negatively (like a free chance of testing your fiance before you make the huge plunge). The great thing about post-martial counseling is that it is much harder to interpret it as an escape/insurance policy – it is all about positive energy… it’s supposed to be anyway…
Since the majority of contributors to this article are foreign MEN, I think there are several HUGE things that people are overlooking.
The main thing is that people are simply looking at sex DURING marriage, not the nature of sex and relationships before marriage, and the nature of relationships in general, sexual or not. I think the Minister of Health should look very closely at what people’s values, ideas, priorities, and desires are BEFORE they get married instead of just going, “OMG WHY AREN’T MARRIED PEOPLE HAVING SEX?!” Instead of starting early and trying to encourage more meaningful, emotional relationships before marriage, they’re waiting till the marriage happens, then going, “Well….stop going to the hostess bar and screw your wife more often.” That is just putting a huge glob of concealor over a cold sore.
Also, again since the majority of the contributors to this article of MEN, people are so disgustingly ready and willing to attack Japanese men’s sexuality, but somehow praise Japanese women’s sexuality. Well, it takes two to tango, so let’s look at both seriously. As this article mentions, ANYTHING sexual is ok to talk about and do….UNTIL you get married. I think THIS is where the problem lies. The passivity of the women here is at least as big a factor as the passivity of the men, if not more. If men hear, “Yes,” to everything sexual, they’re going to get all their kinks satisfied within a month. So who could expect the men to be interested after even a year? Women everywhere else in the world know that saying, “No,” is part of the game. It’s also a way to get things your way, so why haven’t the Japanese figured this out yet?
A lot of women are relieved NOT to have sex because, before marriage, many of them see doing any and every sexual act that a man could possibly want as a way to bait men into marriage. It’s no secret that women here have an almost unnatural obsession with marriage, particularly that it be done BEFORE the age of 30, so they’re willing to do anything to become married. Once they get the marriage (and if they want, get the baby) and the Disney princess fantasy is fulfilled, they feel like they’ve got it all. So who needs sex, or who even needs to use sex to get what you want when everything you want is already there?
Thanks Katie, we really needed some female input in this thread. I’d never thought of it that way. Damn Christmas cake culture!
Don’t women like sex too? I have heard from several women that they “want it just as much as guys do”. I can understand that sex outlives its purpose once Daddy and Mommy get married and have their 2.5 kids (or 1.5 in Japan I guess) but why would there be such a resistance to one of life’s greatest pleasures?
well i will say sex something that is needed in a relationship. it bonds the partners together physically and spiritually. IM not like real religious or anything but since i started makign love to my girlfriend whom i am now engaged to, i could sleep whenever i like. but now i cannot sleep and when i finnaly do it within minutes of the exact time she fell asleep or grew tierd. recently i have felt her feeling even when not around, i can playing a game or hanging out with friends and bam im pissed as hell for no reason. come to find out my gfs parents are either being childish and pissing her off for no reason ( which they do alot) or are trying to make her get rid of me. They hate me for 3 reasons. 1 they feel i spoil her way to much. 2 they call me controlling when all i ask is to know who she hangs our with and when so i know she is safe and dont come over to see her while she is out. i did state i wouldnt mind meeting friends of hers so i can feel safer about her being out with them but im not demanding it. ( personally i dont consider any of that controlling when she demands to know who when where how long why and usually to go with me)
and 3rd i got her pregnant 5 months ago and the baby was aborted due to medical problems. she wasnt healthy enough to have the baby. underweight and not very well nourished. ( and yes it is her choice to be skinny and she isnt anorexic either) but i stuck with her through it all beside her as much as i could. they let her mom back with her for the surgery and the mom said she didnt even want me in the buidling.
with her parents hating me, the pregnancy, and everyone that is against us. i still love my gf we still have sex, not because i make her or she makes me but because we want to. we have went 2 weeks currently do to lack of place and time, she still lives with her parents and i lack truly personal space. we have a great relationship and if not for her parents would be a couple that has little to no problems.
ok now that ive said enough about my relationship i woudl like to ask why the heck is the security word GAIJIN, i am no outsider and that is just plain wrong. i request that is changed to something, anything. for most that may just be another word but i know what it means and to me thats offensive…
Kietsu, I tried really hard to understand what you are trying to tell us… Im sorry, I just don’t get it. Are you Japanese? If so, could you explain to us what you are trying to say in Japanese if it is easier? I’m not making fun of you, just curious.
I am an A.A. female in NYC who has sex with my Japanese fiance almost every night. If we miss a night, we play catch up. On days off we put in overtime. We find each other sexually attractive and have never had a decline in sexual prowess. I don’t know, doesn’t anyone still watch porn?
-The reason gaijin is a security word is because this post has a pattern. Its called using japanese words as security words. regardless of how offended you may be gaijin is a japanese word. Don’t feel bad though, I got osaka… I mean come on… Osaka? That’s bullshit.. (why didn’t I get gaijin?)…
Yeah, I have to agree that mitaboy was getting a bit out of line. Our problem has not been that she doesn’t get satisfied in bed. I have always done everything I can to make sure each time we’re together that my wife reaches the best orgasm possible. The problem is that no matter what communication approach I try, no matter what I do to and for her, no matter how hard she cums, she does little to nothing in return. Often, I have to take her hand and move it on to me. Even then, she often does nothing. She REALLY loves when I go down on her. Since it turns her on so much, early on in our relationship we established a pattern of me doing that nearly every time we have sex. I long thought that the more I ensured that the sex was really good for her, the more likely that she would begin to reciprocate and that she would sometimes initiate sex — that she would become less uptight about sex. My searching the internet for advice is an act of desperation after trying every everything I could think of. I long, long ago dedicated myself to pleasing her, but that just hasn’t seemed to work.
That said, there have been a couple signs of improvement over the past few weeks. Unfortunately, they only involve her letting me do certain things to her, but they are signs that she could finally be getting less uptight. For first time ever (in over 14 years together!), she let me enter her from behind. Previously, she had always stopped me, sometimes saying that it hurt, that she just didn’t like that, or – most often – giving no reason whatsoever. Why it happened this time, I’m not sure, but she REALLY seemed to enjoy it. (Two days later, she fell outside and hurt her knee, which made it impossible to try that again soon. What luck, eh?!) The other thing she let me do was enter a certain previously “forbidden” place (I’m not sure how explicit we can be here – I’ll just hope you can guess what I mean.) with my finger while I was going down on her. She REALLY got into that too! Then, last weekend, she let me try that with my . . . my uh . . . other appendage. (What are the rules for this board? I can’t find them!) I couldn’t get far in before she stopped me, but she really enjoyed it at first. I think I pushed it to the limit that time (I mean that figuratively in this sentence, but I guess it works literally too!), but I’m confident that I didn’t go so far that she would react against such openness next time. Since she continues to express herself so indirectly, I’m never totally sure about what she thinks, but our conversation afterwards seemed to make it clear that she liked it and may want to try again.
Why the change? Well, I’ve redoubled my efforts to take care of the kids and housework. I’ve also tried to be careful to catch myself whenever I start to interpret what she says or does (or doesn’t say or do) as a rejection. After so many years of feeling hurt again and again, that’s not easy, but I could see that my building anger and resentment were not about to help lead toward a solution – quite the contrary, in fact.
I am, however, very wary. This is not the first time there seemed to be signs of thawing. Previously, as soon as I became convinced that we had finally embarked on the path to a closer, more intimate relationship, she started shying away from me and getting very tense. We ended up back in the same place. Right now, I’m asking myself if a major cause of that has been me. Perhaps I have too easily slipped back into bad habits of being lazy around the house as soon as things started to improve. I’m not sure if that’s true, but there’s a real chance that it could be so I’d better be on my guard to make sure that my changes stick.
I still don’t like the fact that the signs of improvement I mentioned involve me doing things to her and that she still sees doing anything sexual together as something to do not more than once a week, but there is some reason for hope. Besides, my complaints are not just about what we do in bed, but the general lack of intimacy and affections. As I said, I just need to be careful to keep working on myself – on how I react to any perceived slights against me and on sharing the burden of our household.
a point to be considered is that if one’s sex life wasn’t what was wanted before marriage then it is unlikely(though possible) that it will change significantly after marriage.
also see post 90. sex has alsways been a tool to hook men, no matter what the culture. and the japanese woman is no different in that regard. a japanese woman’s role changes after childbirth. that’s culture. it’s not likely to change just because she’s married to a non-japanese man.
bear in mind that many japanese women just aren’t as sexual as western women. they can’t be faulted for that, just consider how their own culture objectifies them. japanese women may perhaps ‘be taught’ the how to enjoy sex and initiate, but you’re fighting culture to some degree. this must be realized and dealt with patiently.
You make some good points, mitaboy. I’ve long recognized the fact that her attitude is rooted in culture and I’ve therefore been very patient. Of course, a cultural basis for something does not make it good, does not make it healthy , or right. It certainly makes it damn hard to change though! I have been patient . . . 14 years! But with 4 kids in that time period, I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that we haven’t been able to make much progress. I feel very frustrated at times, but I am feeling hopeful. I know that I can’t expect her to attempt to change something so deeply rooted if I’m not trying to improve myself as a husband (and a father). Yes, I’m glad for the chance to come to this board and blow off some steam – much of it justified, I believe – but I should not deny that there’s still a lot about my own sorry ass that I’ve got to work on! I hope I can do it because I really, really love my wife.
perceptions of ‘right’ and ‘logical’ should be tempered from the perspective of how the other person views it. the best way to have someone see one’s perspective is to have that person “see what’s in it for me”. this may be difficult to do when a problem isn’t perceived.
from a sexual viewpont, bear in mind just as in other aspects of life people like different things to varying degrees. doesn’t make that individual wrong or better, just different. and the fact is, no matter what culture, women will always be different from men and engage in sex for different reasons. doesn’t make them wrong – just different.
as men realize that change begins by looking in the mirror, life does get better.
Kakui,
I feel your pain, brother! Getting your sex life back should be high on your priority list. This is for your sake and your wife’s sake. She may not know it, but by not having sex with you she is denying herself too. Women never lose their desire for sex (my grandma tells me all about it), they just get distracted with kids and other shit that makes their life seem so busy. Just like investment bankers, working 16 hour days and never taking care of their physical needs.
I suggest solving your sexual dilemma in an amusing way. Whatever you do, don’t get too serious about it. The moment she feels compelled to do anything, game over. Be a Don Juan, sweep her off her feet, go over the top in setting the mood. Buy a red-colored light for your bedroom. When she asks why, just grin and turn off the main lights.
Back when I was a 20-year old virgin, my friend gave me the best advice. “How can I get laid?” “Just whip it out” he said. “Put it in her hand and ask her some silly question like “Do you think it’s big?” This may sound like the worst advice you ever heard… well, I did not make it to 21-year old virgin. Sometimes the crazy, off-the-wall approach works!
Anyway, I should note that I am still not married (though close) and I have no kids, so this may affect my understanding of your situation, but I just wanted to help in some way. Shed some new light on the subject. Best of luck! If all else fails, seek counseling!
Since when is a “feminine” and “sexy” figure one with no tits and no ass?
haikei
hajimemashite.watashi wa suriranka kara.namae thusitha. daitai nihon go ga wakari masu. ii tomodachini natte kudasaimasenka.kore wa watashi no e-mail adoresu: thusithadammika@sinhalaya.com
tel:+94-725163077
e-mail o matte imasu
keigu
thusitha
Thusita you sad ass…sign up for stippy friends like the rest of us and try your luck there!
Thusitha… Surii-Saizu ha? Yoroshiku…
Hello Japan culture,
I want to marry a japanese women porn star but how may do that maybe I can stop women from going into pornographic films by marrying them.
I am a chinese muslim I learn this.
my email is quezonspiderman@aol.com maybe you can help me find one with reason enough to marry me as a muslim.
My first post here: I have been married for two years to a Japanese woman. Before that I was married for 15 years to an American. My new wife told me she hadn’t slept with her previous husband for 8 years. I had big problems sexually with my American wife: she only liked the missionary position and refused to let me go down on her. She would never get wet enough “down there” and my efforts to get inside invariably resulted in premature ejaculation. KY jelly, lubricated condoms helped, but were always messy.
My Japanese wife loves it when I go down on her. When we first married we were doing it sometimes two or three times a day (okay, I hadn’t had sex in over a year at the time). Today, two years later we have slowed down. We have sex only two or three times on the weekends. But she is always complaining that we don’t have sex often enough! It’s getting so that I often have “performance anxiety.” I suspect she has an ulterior motive: she wants a baby. I think our ages (me,49 and she,44) are thwarting her plans.
I sometimes pinch myself, to make sure I really am this happy. I think I do make the extra effort to please my wife: I help with the housework, I give her my salary, etc. I think a big factor is my bad grasp of the Japanese language: I can’t understand her when she is angry with me, so I just apologize and a fight never really gets started! I think Japanese women are very, very beautiful, and I am sure the interracial thing adds a lot of spice to our sex. My wife and other Japanese women tell me Japanese men are lazy around the house and very childish. Thank you, Japanese men!
I’m happily married to a Japanese woman & have been for nearly 5 years. Our early days of marriage were filled with rampant sex & great satisfaction which eventually resulted in two wonderful kids. After our second child, things began to dry up a bit sexually.
I think this was just a natural progression, something that happens to most couples after having children. We went from having sex about thrice a week to having it only once a month….but when we did have it it was always really good for both of us.
I think the point I am trying to put accross is that, whatever culture you’re from, who ever you’re married too, sex after childbirth is always different & usually declines. It’s not a cultural thing, it’s a hormonal thing that everyone will experience at somepoint in their life once they’ve had children.
It does not just apply to women, men’s hormones also go a bit haywire after becoming a Dad…..the natural pattern is that the first child brings desire to have anothre, a sibling for the first child to grow up with; hence sexual desire is still strong after the first.
But after the second the sexual drive depletes, & for me it was obvious when this was happening. After that point a natural desire to concentrate on providing for the children took over & I consequently concentrated harder on my work & my wife concentrated harder on rearing the kids in the home.
We spent about two years in an alomost sexually passive period, but all of a sudden just the other day the drive came on again!! I managed sex thrice in one night, something I never thoughht I’d be capable of again after having two kids! My wife was shocked, but not withholding….& now I’m getting hot for it everyday (something that hasn’t happened for over 4 years since becoming a dad).
I think it’s human nature for men to continue wanting sex more than women. That’s the way we have been designed & is perhaps the reason why the Japanese, who understand this nature, expect men to have extra marital affairs & view it as OK.
Personally I expect most men in the world to have extra marital affairs / or at least jerk off to porn on a regular basis in secret. Given our relogious cultures, CHristianity & Catholicism, we have been taught to be ashamed of masturbation, & to relinquish our sexual desires, which only leads to “adulterous” actions anyway. in Japan it seems that they are open to sex & are almost too acceptant of this natural mechanism to want to stick your phallus in something, that they just turn a blind eye to it. Surely an intelligent man can direct his sexual desire to his partner. If his partner is spurning him then that’s a different matter, & of course he’s going to need to do something else to fulfill his drive.
I kind of hold respect for the Japanese view that men are likely to go on & do this, but I do wish that Japanese men would try harder to keep the home fires burning with their wives. It seems that they themsleves have become resigned to the fact that going to strip joints / using sex services / or just having a bit on the side is part & parcel of society without really trying to make it happen at home.
I have to say after reading all the post here on this site, I have to come to the conclusion that all you guys are Pussy Whipped Punks who did not set things straigh to begin with. First, as I combe through the internet and read Gaijin experiences with Japanese “cuties”, I get the feeling that the men treat these women like they are “special” than other women. They seem to be fooled by the innocent appearance and petite body of these women. These women are WOMEN…just fucking women guys..nothing special. You guys kiss their asses, as you think you are getting some “faithful” cute prize that you can parade around with since you are most likely incapable of getting the same level of pussies back home in the States or where you come from.
Now me: I met my Japanese bitch in Graduate school. I wasted no time fucking her….. and we still together although her ass is in Japan and mine is in the States. I screamed at her, pretty much from the beginning and let her know she was nothing special, just a bitch to me and if she plays her cards right I may keep her ass. She let me know, she was not attracted to Japanese guys cause they are SOFT….like you guys are. Now me..I am a divorcee, with no kids, from a bitch that was the bitch of bitches here in the States. Yep, I got married, when I was 19 years old to this ugly fucking 37 year ho bag. I learned alot about bitch mind games and stinking pussy being with held and promised myself that I will never let another WHORE Pussy Whipped me again. Oh yeah, for four years I was a money earning pussy whipped mudda fucker. Anyways, I am still angry at myself and this aggression is prominent with any woman I get with. Ok, continuing with my Japanese taming story. She tries to pressure me to marry her, since 2005 and I told her, I don’t need a wife…and pretty much she is useless unless I feel like getting married. You see, I am talented in cooking and house chores too…….thanks to my lazy fucking Stepmother who made me do all those chores, so ofcourse I know how to do all that shit too, plus I am good looking, educated, make my money and simply don’t give a fuck about a woman’s feelings sometimes (Ok, I pretend I don’t). But I have her trained in all aspects of what I want and what her role will be, and I have told her I am not above slapping the fuck out of her too ( although I wouldn’t since an assault charge will ruin my career) Guess what I am?
My point is guys…is this…you guys portrayed yourself the same way the Japanese guys do with their women. Too eager to please them and let them get away with bullshit. I have told my woman that if she ever holds sex as a ransom from me…..I will simply dump her ass and find many bitches who would gladly take her role. You have to make your voice clear, and it does not matter if you are in Japan or not. Be willing to be the man, no matter what. Since I have a big aversion to COMMITMENT its so easy for me to dump a broad. And I have her ass on the pill and even though her parents are begging for a kid…Ok, I will reveal here that I am a black male: they want to have Exotic looking black grand children and so does she. I told her, that I will not be second to NONE. I don’t want children with her or any bitch for that matter. I have seen the results of ill fated marriages and money hungry ho’s trying to get you to pay 90% of your paycheck to support some fucking ungrateful brats, who you never get to see or play with.
SO FELLOWS……..Stand up and treat that Japanese bitch like shit. Come on….have you not notice women try to please a man that they think will trade their ass in. It does help to be smart, good looking, full of ambition, athletic and a bad attitude. I cuss my Japanese girlfriend all the time and hang up on her ass when I get tired of her trying to persuade me to be positive. Plus, I make her send me money……. That way, you make sure if she is willing to loose all her worth and money to have a relationship with you, she must either be in real love or just a really stupid bitch. Anyways, I hope you’ll keep it real…..
And no…black guys are not all assholes Japanese women……JUST ME. I live by the motto..”No pussy is that good”
“I have told her I am not above slapping the fuck out of her too ( although I wouldn’t since an assault charge will ruin my career) Guess what I am?”
Lawyer?
Nah man….I am DEA, but JAG (Military) was my second choice, since getting hired by this fucking agency is so tough.
And yet another prime example why America has the stupidest law enforcement people in the world, and an uneducated population that keeps them in power. Mr. Tibett calls himself educated….hmmm, I would know what his standard for retarded is, because he certainly sounds like one from any other country on this planet.
Mr Tibett: Get some anger management, get some help, or you will find yourself 60, alone, miserable and even more pathetic than you are now. But I guess you will just keep on being the braindead person you are, and play with your gun and rant on how pleased you are with yourself on your delusional power trip. Get a life my fellow stippy reader.
while mr tibett has a ‘unique’ way of expressing himself, and i certainly don’t agree with all of what he says, many american men do tend to put japanese women on a pedestal then complain when the sex dries up.
i’ve had success by just telling women what my sexual expectations are(3 – 5x a week) , letting them know that i’m focused on their pleasure, and moving on from there.
TAXED MAN:
You know, if was very angry for a long time, but anger management only made me more angrier. And please fool, compared to me, you are perhaps a moron; You have no clue what it takes to be a Fed Agent and how dare a couch potato punk like you insult the brave REAL MEN and Women putting their lives on the line everyday. What are you, one of these “English” teaching gaijin? I only wrote it in a language so that someone with your extremely limited intellect may be able to grasp the concept of the story.
Now down to business. MITA BOY, I think 3-5 days a week is good! and you are a stand up guy taking care of business.
Keep it real ya’ll.
As a black professional woman, I am ashamed of the image that Tibett put out. You sound no better than a kindergartner who can not have his way. If anger management didn’t help, maybe you should commit yourself to a nice federally funded institution. Our government is foolish enough to pay you to be a DEA? ……. I’m sorry… I had to take a minute…. I just puked a little… Your attitude leaves a bad taste in my mouth… Tib, your attitude and lack of respect for women is a disgrace, not only to you, but to your mother who I am sure thinks she should’ve have chosen the coat hangar.
By the way, America does have one of the stupidest law enforcement SYSTEMS in the world. I cannot put down the individuals who work hard to support families, but I can’t stand to see people like you who make everyone else’s hard work not worth a damn…
You’re a lucky man. A better woman would have sprinkled arsenic in your donburi…
Professional Black Women, it is sad that you are ashamed of yourself. You see, your lack of pride of simply being a black person is why the world will always treat blacks like third class citizen, rather than the powerful nubians we really are. But this is not about race…its about you not accepting that all men are not pussy whipped weaklings ready to get with the self righteous “woman movement” busllshit that has overshadowed real men in America.
Some questions to you:
1. Have you ever served in the Armed Forces?
2. Have you ever been shot, while on duty, trying to clear black neighborhoods of drug dealers?
3. Have you ever volunteer your time in inner cities to help old people; minister positive goals to young black youths?
4. Have you ever been civil justice?
You see, I picture you as one of the same prissy cows, thinking because they travelled to a fucking foreign land it gives them the right to use Japanese alphabet as a Forum Post name. You are not Japanese and I highly doubt you are anything other than a self centered bitch who has never done a day of self act to help others. I have seen and dealt with your kind and Sista….you aint pretty. And by the way…my mother was a bitch! And Daddy did beat her ass.
My relationship with my Japanese woman is great. She knows her role………learn yours!
Interesting, while I served in the DEA we were forbidden to make comments on internet sites, claiming we were agency crew and making such public representations of our opinions.
wow times really are changing, I guess anyone is in now huh!
Aaaah, now its time to respond. If your lucky, you may learn something Tibs.
Ashamed of being black: never. Ashamed that you are black: YES!
I am proud to be of African descent. Everyday I find ways to bring myself closer to my African heritage. And not once have I ever been treated like a third class citizen. But you are right, this isn’t about race, its about your disregard for the rights of all human regardless of nationality.
Answers to your questions:
1. I was born in the Marines fool. After living that life, I think I have had my share of a parent that suffered mental disturbances in a war started by caucasians in power to benefit caucasians in power. I refuse to fall into that trap that America has set up for poor youth.
2. No, never been shot on duty. I work in a hospital sweetie. We don’t shoot each other. We help those who have been shot. Have you ever pulled a bullet out of a young black boy who got caught in the cross fire of drug dealers war? You would never know… People like you can only hurt, never heal.
3. I volunteer with NYPD auxilary. I volunteer at group homes, AIDS prevention programs….
4. Have I ever been civil justice….? No, I don’t think I have been civil justice, that’s not possible. I have however taken part in civil justice by showing up to jury duty and enjoying it.
You can picture me as a prissy cow… Cows can’t type. I can.
I have not travelled to A foreign land, I have travelled to MANY. I have to right to use whatever symbols I want to represent my name. I am not Japanese, but the guy I married is…. I am a bitch, and the things I do to help people are not “self-acts” as you put it, they are done because people need help and if they had to rely on you to do it, there would be a whole generation of black youths hanging from the rafters by their Nike laces.
I have dealt with YOUR kind before. Aint nothing sweeter than beating the ignorance out of a man with my two bare fists.
From your point of view, it wouldn’t be pretty…
PS- It would be just like an ugly man to attack a woman’s features without having an inkling of what she looks like.
And its Professional Black WOMAN, singular not plural.
DEA my ass…. It looks like the first letters that floated up in your soup became your profession… You should try harder to pick a job in your soup that fits you, like LOSER.
TRUCE TO ALL.
Yes Pango, times has changed, we are now DOHS.
What does DOHS stand for?
カミラ
Way to stand up for yourself. Just out of curiosity, and since this is a sexless thread, have you experienced sexlessness with your Japanese husband?
i haven’t experienced this sexlessness in japan, quite the opposite. are japanese people sexless when they are NOT in japan?
Ao,
I haven’t experienced sexlessness… I hope I never do. I feel bad for the men on this thread.
To other men on this thread:
I don’t know if this will help, but a woman is most easily aroused right before her period begins.
Downside is, if she suffers from PMS she’ll be a little more cranky than usual; so you may have to butter her up.
Another hint: no chocolate. If you want sex, stop letting her eat chocolate. The enzymes in chocolate replicate enzymes released during sexual activity. Don’t let Hershey have his way with your wife.
Women are visual: why not write an erotic story that stars you and your wife and give it to her page by page…
TALK to her. Everyone has been saying it. It can be effective.
Oh, and soft porn…. I know that sounds lame, but I only say soft because I don’t know other womens taste… find out what she likes and watch it with her…
Hi all,
I found this thread very interesting and informative, and would like to revive it for some updates.
I just got married myself last year to a lovely Japanese woman whom I love and am deeply committed to, but also found a simliar trend to what has been mentioned here – great sex before engagement, a waning during engagement, and then after a fantastic honeymoon a sudden drop in sex!!
We are both working hard at our jobs, so that may be the reason, but other comments and experinces are welcome … advice too ….
Joe Bloe,
Looking back at the mistakes I’ve made over the past 13+ years of marriage, I offer this piece of advice: deal with it now! My biggest mistake is that I kept putting off confronting the pitiful state of our sex life, hoping that it would improve on its own. I’m trying to deal with it now, but with four kids and habits ingrained, it’s only gotten harder. As you might imagine, our lives are now much more complex than they were when we were a newly maried couple. It takes guts, of course, to confront such issues, and I lacked those guts at that time — or that or I was simply guilty of a sort of lazy delusion. (It’s probably both!)
In any case, start dealing with it now, but also have patience. The few attempts I did make earlier on were done with kindness and understanding, but not with enough patience. I would too quickly give up on any real efforts and go back to just hoping that things would somehow improve on their own. Perhaps I often confused patience with lack of action.
If you really love her and your truly committed to this marriage, take action — and keep engaged with the issue — but have patience.
And never take advice from Mr. Tibitt!
a partial reprint of an article available on the net… keep the wheat throw out the chaff
[It’s almost laughable to hear foreign men talk about the sexual times they had with their Japanese spouse before marriage, and how now sex seldom occurs. These men are shocked and angry. Haven’t they realized that though many Japanese women appear sexy and attractive that they aren’t nearly as sexual as Western women? The statistics are everywhere; Japanese people don’t have sex as frequently as other cultures.
So what happened?
Japanese women are as smart as most women; they realize that one way to catch a man is through his penis. That means sex is bait! Japanese women don’t have the bait market cornered, no matter what culture sex has always been a tool to ‘hook’ a man. In many instances, the Japanese woman in fact hasn’t experienced the true pleasure of sex but just gave the foreign man what he wanted, no different than she would have done with a Japanese man. The difference between Japanese and Western women is that Western women may desire sex more frequently—again just look at the statistics.
However, with enough moans of excitement a man can be seduced into thinking he has found real love AND that he is a super lover. Amazing how unaware of the truth some men can be. For most men, the fact is that they aren’t fantastic lovers, so it’s easier for them to get hooked. If you are a man reading this, become a better lover and you won’t be caught by sex. A good lover truly focuses on the sexual and emotional needs of the woman. From the Japanese woman’s perspective, the foreign man is more polite and considerate than the ‘typical’ Japanese man because of his ‘ladies first’ attitude. So she is ‘willing’ to get married, even if the sex isn’t good—after which sex dwindles and the husband complains.
Now that she’s married why should she want sex? She has her husband, a gaijin man, her status symbol and the envy of many Japanese women. Sex wasn’t that good for her anyway. It was bait and it served it’s purpose. Amazing that foreign men don’t realize this fact. Now he’s trapped in a marriage and is angry because the sex has dried up. Wrongly, he faults her and tries to introduce sexual variety, basically what satisfies his fantasies and he hopes will satisfy her. The bottom line is that sex was never that good for her in the first place and he didn’t really satisfy nor develop a sexual need in her. Combine this with the time constraints of kids and possibly a job. The woman is just too tired and not interested enough to have sex with him.
A key thought, if sex isn’t good for her then there is absolutely no good reason for her to want sex. A woman should not have sex just because the man wants it; that isn’t a good enough reason. Good sex for a woman can be like their favorite food or dessert: if it’s good she will crave it and ask for it. ]
Thank you to both you of you for the supportive and advisory replies! This what I think these kinds of blogs can be – other’s experiences which let you know you are not alone and can help based on experience (not stereotypes), and also put the responsibility on looking at yourself first (ouch).
Are there also any foreign women who have Japanese spouses – I think that their perspective would be a welcome even more valuable and informative input? Thanks again.
I am sure most of you will agree that the way to a mans heart is through his stomach. Well, the way to a womans heart goes through her private parts. Get some olive oil and get buisy you guys. Lube it and get that plug in viberator going just as you stick it in her. Have her hold onto it so it hits her where she wants it. It isn’t in the way as much as you may think. Don’t leave home without it, even on vacation. 28 years later I am still married and still get it when I want it.
Those who think the whole problem with low-sex or no-sex marriages is due to techniques in bed don’t know what they’re talking about. I’ve tried just about everything you can imagine to make sure that sex is nothing but enjoyable for her. Those efforts have largely worked in that she loves what I do to and for her. The problem is that she does not respond in the way that I (and most people I know) would expect – e.g. “That was great! Let’s do it again!” . . . or “Thanks so much, Honey, for making me feel so good. Let me return the favor!” . . . or, best of all, “I love you.”
Those efforts, by the way, have always been done with loving words and gestures. In and out of bed, I’m constantly telling her how beautiful she is, how sexy she is . . . that she looks even better than on the day we married. And I really mean it — I’ve never said that just hoping that she’ll then “put out”. I love her dearly and would do anything for her. But maybe this goes to the heart of the problem: she doesn’t really love me and would not “do anything” for me. I hope that’s not true, but it probably is.
If that’s true, I wish she would at least TRY to love me. If you marry someone and even have kids with him/her, I would think that you would at least want to try to love that person. I do believe it’s possible for love to grow where none existed . . . or where it once was but has left . . . but such cases, you’ve got to put effort into it.
I know I sound pitiful (and that in this situation, I am, in fact, pretty damn pitiful!), but I guess that’s the way unrequited love goes. It’s one of the oldest stories around, and it frequently brings otherwise strong people to embarrassing states of weakness. If you never experience it, you’re lucky. If you declare yourself immune, you’ve got other issues you need to work on – besides, of course, your total lack of empathy!
Kakui,
Too much one-way-love only worsens the problem. Sometimes, you have to be an asshole. By all means, don’t give her a guilt trip about not loving you enough. One book I read and learned a lot from is called “How to Succeed with Women”. Much of the book is crap, and it focuses too much on getting sex, but I learned a lot about how women think and work, and what sort of things men should be doing and, more importantly, not doing.
In your case, I think the answer may be doing the opposite of what you are doing. However, I don’t know the specifics or what kind of person your wife is, so be careful of advice from strangers.
one thing i realized early on in life is that people generally don’t change very much after their teens.
i have been married, now divorced(had nothing to do with sex, she wanted to even after knowing the papers were going to be final) after not being to adjust to a personality trait that i chose to ignore before marriage. sex was very good, other aspects(that i ignored – my fault for doing so) weren’t tolerable. no hate there, we are still friends.
my only point is that men generally have a picture of who there wife is before they marry.
Kakui
[Those who think the whole problem with low-sex or no-sex marriages is due to techniques in bed don’t know what they’re talking about. I’ve tried just about everything you can imagine to make sure that sex is nothing but enjoyable for her. Those efforts have largely worked in that she loves what I do to and for her. The problem is that she does not respond in the way that I (and most people I know) would expect – e.g. “That was great! Let’s do it again!” . . . or “Thanks so much, Honey, for making me feel so good. Let me return the favor!” . . . or, best of all, “I love you.”]
please don’t be offended, but if she didn’t do it before marriage there’s no reason to expect it after marriage. if she did it before marriage reference my post number 124
Jeez, I feel really sorry for all these frustrated people! As I mentioned in my post#105, I am pretty happy with my marriage of two years to a Japanese woman. Maybe I should describe our relationship and some of you can see whether there are some shortcomings in your behavior/efforts.
1) I always tell my wife she is beautiful and sexy, at least 20 times a day.
2) I REALLY help with the housework, from laundry and dishwashing to vacuuming and cleaning the bathroom.
3) We do “dakko” at least once a day: she sits on my lap, facing me, one leg on each side of me and we hug each other for a long time, while talking about whatever we want.
4) Our sex mainly involves me going down on her until she comes at least two or three times, THEN we have intercourse, using different positions. For some reason, our sex never seems “old.” When she says thank you (sometimes she says “tensai”), I say “kochira koso” (me, too). As I said in my #105, our frequency is down a bit, now only two to three times on weekends. Frankly, anymore and I would get peformance anxiety.
5) I think massage is vital to a good relationship. It feels good and lets your partner know you care. You can massage her all over her body, don’t forget her face. Put your fingers in the back of her hair and lightly scratch her scalp.
6) You are going to groan at this, but I always open the car door for her and help her put on/take off her coat (especially in public!).
7) Buying presents is an art and an absolute must. I can’t say I have mastered it. She enjoys telling her friends about the unromantic gifts I have given her (don’t get her a coffee grinder for Christmas… even if you plan on using it yourself to make her fresh coffee every morning–yes, I do every morning).
That would be perhaps my CALL FOR HELP: what are some good, original, ROMANTIC, not too expensive gifts to give your Japanese wife? Yes, yes, I have already given flowers, jewelry (she lost that necklace) and sexy underwear.
HappyInJapan,
Good for you. Any guys who are thinking, “That’s too much work” or “It’s not worth the trouble” well you will reap what you sow. Don’t think of it as doing something for her, think of it as doing something for yourself. Kind of a wake up call for me, too. Time to start opening the car doors again.
I’ve tried to read through all these responses and find it curious that no one has considered that this isn’t about culture but about variability in libido and physiological responses to sexual stimulation. For the most part, the types of people who are likely to post responses to this article are the type in the same boat as the author.
If you consider that there are a lot people who are crazy about chocolate and some who are indifferent to it and accept that this is normal variation in tastes then it’s easy to believe that there are some people for whom sex is simply not all that appealing, particularly in light of the time it takes and the effort that goes into it.
I’m neither Japanese nor married to a Japanese person so I can’t speak from experience but mainly from logic and an understanding of psychology. It does make sense that there will be some people who will be indifferent to sexual activity and others who may eventually grow bored with it no matter what because, no matter how many different roads you take, the destination is always the same. (I’m not saying this is true for me but just it makes sense.)
I have talked to a fair number of foreign men with Japanese wives and girlfriends and I’ve been told many of their partners seem to have orgasms almost instantly. I’ve pondered whether or not there is a physiological difference for Japanese women or whether or not they’re culturally coached to fake it and never really develop a taste for sex as a pleasurable experience. I can’t say which and I can’t even say that this is true of more than a handful of women but it is food for thought.
I particularly wonder if there is something about the culture and the overt objectification of women sexually that may make them feel more put upon when men desire them. While women are objectified in most cultures, most of them aren’t exposed quite so freely and frequently to men reading explicit publications on trains, animation on T.V., or movies showing rape almost casually. This, coupled with the gropers on trains, may leave some of them feeling like pieces of meat. Could some of them be blamed for repressing their sexual sides because they feel almost oppressive attention from men who they have no interest in? Men tend to feel that women are flattered by their sexual interest but too much of it tends to start making women want anything but because they start to feel you only value their bodies.
I’m not making any proclamations or reaching any conclusions but I think it may be useful to look past the obvious answers Most people who have issues with sex either have a physiological issue or a psychological issue that they don’t understand the roots of.
Well, Shari sure gives us some food for thought. It’s always dangerous to generalize about a whole culture from the experiences of a few people. That’s a very good point that mainly people with the same problem are going to be responding to a blog like this, which gives the appearance of unanimity when it’s really only a small sample.
Do Japanese women have orgasms quicker than other women? Are they just faking orgasms? In my very limited experience it does seem true that Japanese women are more wild in bed and really get into it, resulting in quicker and more orgasms. This might have to do with the interracial element making the sex more exciting?
Early in our relationship, my wife seemed to come very quickly, we would have many “restarts” after orgasms, when she would have to catch her breath, and she claimed she had “come” many, many times. But more recently, I have noticed it takes much longer for her to get an orgasm. We seem to get into cycles of her “getting somewhere”, only to have her noticeably relax, but when she finally does come (or “go” as the Japanese like to say), the orgasm does seem to last longer. She told me this is exactly what is happening. She is simply holding off on coming as long as she can to heighten the orgasm when it finally comes. All I know is, my tongue, jaw and fingers are about ready to fall off!
Is she faking it? I don’t think she is faking it. She often signals her interest in sex (by wearing something sexy to bed or grabbing my privates in the morning) and sometimes she complains we don’t have sex enough. Would she do these things if she didn’t like sex?
I think Shari is right in saying we each have our own issues regarding sex, stemming from our upbringing, and physical things come into it, too. But maybe where I live is different from the big cities in Japan. I don’t notice the pervasive sexual fixation here that Shari is describing as typical of Japan. I have never seen any simulated rape scenes on TV. I know the Mangas in the bookstores can be pretty hardcore. I can imagine unwanted sexual advances could annoy women, but I don’t see how that should turn them off from sex in a loving relationship.
I’m from the US, and been married to a Japanese woman for 10 years and lived/worked in Japan for 12. Your article’s topic hit close to home.
First of all, for all of you who aren’t even in Japan, nor married to Japanese, nor have kids yet (that’s a big one) your ideas are interesting, but are nowhere near my experiences or anyone in the same boat as I who I’ve talked with. The guys married to Japanese who have kids fall along the same lines as I – Before marriage/before kids: good sex, after marriage/after kids: little/no sex.
And I have other Japanese guy friends who I talk to too. Same story. Unless you’re still working on more kids, there’s not a lot going on under the futon. But probably a for more practical and mundane reasons than people might think. Without going into a lot of psychological conjecture I’ll list my top 3 reasons.
1. Kids sleep with parents until they’re in Junior High (or old enough to WANT to sleep by themselves)
2. Spouses have drastically different schedules. Most “Salarymen” still work until late at night, regardless of what you read about how “official” working hours have been reduced in Japan.
3. Spouses barely have any time alone or privacy. See 1 and 2.
Overcoming those obstacles are hard enough. Combine that with the fact that my wife seems perfectly satisfied with being JUST a mother, rather than a wife and mother, and the product of this equation doesn’t lead to a lot of copulation. Other husbands, both Japanese and foreigner alike tell the same story. Japanese wives switch roles apon becoming a mother.
Thanks Simeon for your honet comment – well now I am REALLY depressed – given that this kind of blog attracts those who are of like mind or have the same ‘problem’ (so its a small sample, or not… – I have a sneaky suspicion of under-reporting on this), how extensive is this really? I am getting hints now about making babies on a virtual desert of sexual inactivity ….. I feel like I am being/have been had. More wine pleeeease.
Oh well.
@Joe Bloe
Don’t give up yet, my wife works too, so it makes it extra difficult. And I really haven’t been able to put a lot of time into getting the activity back, for obvious reasons. Maybe other people who are in a different situation have some more hopeful experiences for you.
But at least it shouldn’t be a stretch of the imagination as to why married couples in Japan find “alternative” sources for sex.
@Simeon
Thanks – I don’t intend to give up as i love my wife dearly, and you are right, not having the time to even try is exacerbating the non-activity too. Anyway, I feel like now I am going through each of the first 4 of Kubler-Ross’ emotional behavior stages, at various stages if that is possible :
* Denial (this isn’t happening to me!)
* Anger (why is this happening to me?)
* Bargaining (I promise I’ll be a better person if…)
* Depression (I don’t care anymore)
* Acceptance (I’m ready for whatever comes [or whoever doesn't in this case ...] )
I don’t think these apply only to physical health …. there is still loss in this. Anyway, my appreciation of farce and irony is what keeps me going, and I appreciate you sharing your point of view.
I was searching for japanese marriage statistics for an assignment and this comes up o.O.
God dang I’m appualed at this perversion.
=/
I am a foreign woman who was married to a Jap. man for many years and I can say that aftr 3 years of marriage the sex went out of the door. We were like roommates until I decided to divorce him. and even then he couldn’t understand why I wanted to leave him, he would say just don’t ask me for anything and we can stay together. So for him it was normal to be sexless in his mid thirties because that is how most Japanese men are. No libido.
I live in jpn and this country is a desert for women.
And I must say I am quite a curvy woman with a good size derriere and a big bust, most men aren’t intersted in that, they all like these fake blondes who look like cheap barbie dolls and speak in a squeaky voice.
An advice to foreign women who are thinking of coming to this sexless land, don’t come unless you like these nerdy, ugly men with pencil size penises who are scared of a foreign woman.
Jade,
Was it good at the beginning? So many of the posts here talk about gaijin men who had great sex at the beginning but then it dried up like a puddle in the desert. Is it the same for gaijin women? Any idea what did it?
Wow Jade harsh words… You sound awfully bitter. But you shouldn’t classify all Japanese men negatively because you’ve had a bad experience. You say Japanese men don’t like women with bust and rear, but that’s not true… And unless you’ve had sex with every man out here you can’t determine that they all have pencil dicks. Because when you stoop so low as to refer to a whole group of men that way, its easy for someone to say that you’re lying about curves, and that you’re just a chubby woman who doesn’t know how to attract a man sexually.
Japanese men aren’t scared of foreign women… they are actually very polite and they speak to you when given the chance. You sure your bitterness doesn’t scare them off…?
Choose your words carefully.
This has been an interesting thread to read and of course very familiar to hear these stories, how many gaijin have been caught out in the trap.
But the answer is quiet simple in terms of keeping the marriage sexlife active, it is just very alien and sometimes even repugnant to westerners.
When you marry a japanese women you really are the lord and master, their society over hundreds of years has evolved like that.
If you stop acting like that your wife will lose respect for you and will simply become a robot. Since the end of the war and the emergence of the salaryman this has become the norm in many japanese marriages as well as cross cultural ones.
If a gaijin learns early that sex is something that you can demand any time from your wife without questions or reasons why not and that you can order your wife to the bedroom at the drop of a hat, and that this is what she EXPECTS from you and what she ENJOYS, then she will stay the beautiful passionate women you married.
if you tenderly ask her if she is “up for it” chances are she will say no or be too shy and over time your sex life will die. Dont give herthe option and tell her what to do sexually and the passion never dies.
If you have a problem with that then you have married the wrong nationality plain and simple. east is east.
not all japanese men have fallen into the weak salaryman trap. a very wise japanese man of the old school who was a student of mine taught me that and saved me many years of unhappy marriage. My wife is my best friend and the hottest women i have met and after seven years and one kid we still at the very very least have sex three or four times a week.
Good call. Many women get turned on by a man who knows what he wants and takes it. You can be a nice guy the rest of the time (and I suggest you do, since modern Japanese girls are not happy to play the servant role like their mothers did) but when the lights go out you should take a more dominating role. It gets them aroused. You need to take it when you want it. Pure sexual desire that can’t be stopped is quite sexy to a lot of women. You just need to know where to draw the line. If she ever says no in a serious voice you need to stop. But remember that sex is animal in nature, and should never begin with a discussion as to whether or not to have sex.
This reminds me of a funny tale. I had a Brazilian friend in Japan before and he was telling me about his first sexual experience with a Japanese woman. She started moaning “yamete, yamete”. So he actually stopped. The girl was like, “WTF? I didn’t mean it literally.”
I`m from Scotland have a Japanese wife,she is a very kind and caring person and we had a good sex life,but we got married 3 month`s ago and I have noticed that our sex life has taken a dive,I will not explain to much about sex,but We really don`t have much of a sex life now,so I can understand the above comments on this issue.I really don`t know why this is the case,Honestly i believed this was just our case till I came across this site and seen there is many people that have this same problem. I love my wife and also see her as a friend,though I believe a wife should be a best friend and also lover.But what can we do? Loose the love of our lives because they don`t have as much sex with us,that is not good and would be very wrong,but I do feel sex is and should be important in a relationship and I guess we need to also accept WE did agree to have a Japanese G/F and wife,so we need to find something that works for all of us in our relationships.though that is hard,right guys? anyway thank you for reading my message
oh and btw,I live in Japan with her..sorry just forgot to say
colin
please pardon me, would you mind answering the following…
how old are you?
how many non-japanese girlfriends have you had?
how many japanese girlfriends did you have before your wife?
how long did you date before marriage?
Mitaboy
I`m 31 also My wife is the same age.and For the Girlfriends that I`ve had,around 4 that were western.and to answere you about how many Japanese g/f`s i had,well just one before My wife,though that was not really a good example of a G/f,as It was long distance,but we did stay together for many months .. and i was dating My wife for around 1 and a half years before we got married.. so how about you? do you have a Japanese wife?
colin thanks
not married. have had several j-gfs. i’m studying this phenomenon and have discussed it with sevral j-girls & guys.
are you in tokyo?
i really would like to chat with you outside of the board
Yeah I live in Tokyo,Koto ku area…are you in Tokyo?
in minato-ku. we could meet at shinagawa station, or ginza. if we chose a location, date and time that might work
Ginza is best for me over the next few days i will be kinda busy,but monday will be fine..do you know where Bic camera is in Ginza? and anytime is ok for me ..
yes. i work in front of bic camera how about 3:00pm. i can meet you at the main entrance. i’ll be wearing a suit. not being modest, i’ll be the best dressed gaijin there. almost like i stepped out of a magazine. very easy to pick out.
ok 3pm just outside Bic camera,and maybe you`ll be the 2nd best dressed Gaijin lol
are you American? British? I`m from Scotland..
ha hah ha
i’m american. great!!! don’t mind being second. so many gaijin dress so poorly.
08/20/07 @ 1500 monday
c yAA!
ok man..see you monday @3pm
Mitaboy, we would certainly like to hear more about what it is that you are looking into. I’m glad that you have arranged this meeting here, but not so sure others would like to know. I might set up a forum where we can all privately message each other soon.
In the mean time, if you both agree, I can send you each other’s email addresses?
great!! i agree, please give him my email address
Hello my friends. I saw this page on google and came to visit since I too am in romantic courtship of the Japanese woman. I don’t have problem with the sexual gratification of her. She loves the love I give to her all the time too. Maybe Czech are good lover like me and so the woman wants to have the big thing in her all the time.
Thank you
Mitaboy, Colin,
How was last week? Anything for this board and its avid readers?
steve88
the meeting didn’t come off with colin due to scheduling conflicts.
however, would be interested in meeting anyone that could make it to ginza, or shinagawa
Sorry Mita
This is my last entry in this site as I feel there is people here that do wish to discuss this matter in a serious way and recently there are just fools that use racist views about women ..This is supposed to be a place to talk about the above issue but as usual people come here and bring it down ..the internet has became a joke and that is due to people like 158 and 159…this is NOT the kind of views I appreciate ….just shows me how far society has fell….there is good people here and people that have sense,but for the most part some people have spoiled it and I dont want to be part of it..at first I just wanted to see if other people with Japanese wifes had that issue,but now it is between me and my wife,which has become a lot better with talking to her about it,as I was scared before to ask why there was some problems,which was my fault,as I should have spoke to her before..but now we are both happy..colin signing off…..
Comment from Blue: All the offending posts have now been removed. It is a shame that some people stop the discussion with racism. Don’t leave us Colin.
I’m sorry that those kinds people that scare off real persons who come to actually talk. I hope things work out for the best Colin, Good Luck!
I’m pretty happy for you Colin. It sounds like you had an issue with your wife and decided to talk to her about it. That’s often the hardest thing to do but it has got to be the best medicine. Even if your wife is of the same culture it is no easy task communicating accurately with her. I always try to communicate more rather than less to prevent problems but it is always a struggle. Good for you Colin.
I rarely delete comments. They have to be pretty bad (or plain moronic) to make me remove them, but the racist ones here were not tolerable.
This site should be active communication on Japanese related topics. Heated discussion and wildly different ideas – yes, plain boring racism – no.
To all, if I have personally offended anyone during my argument with the previous poster, it was not intentional. I get a little defensive over things like that sometimes. Sorry.
As a guy who almost married a Japanese girl many years ago, then married and divorced a Japanese-English Canadian, I have to laugh at some of these posts.
Post 19 could apply to just about any marriage to any woman.
If you want passion, sex and love, have a girlfriend.
If you want obligations, duty and tedium, well, ….get married.
After a long custody battle, I have my kids half the time, and pay a significant amount of child support, but I am free (living in America). Had I divorced in Japan, I would have my kids torn away from me in a heartbeat with absolutely no hope of ever seeing them again. Life would be worthless.
Times have changed – be selfish. That is something modern men seem to have difficulty doing. God only knows women have been conditioned to think for themselves, after 40 years of feminist indoctrination.
If you are living in wonderful Japan, have a few girlfriends and enjoy life. The only people concerned about shoshika are bureaucrats. Live life, enjoy your girlfriend, and take advantage of the pleasures life in Japan has to offer.
乾杯！
an interesting observation is that of the japanese women(all single and under 40 y.o.) with whom i’ve disussed this issue of sexual frequency among married couples all have said it is a case by case situation. perhaps using their married friends as a basis for their conclusion OR were they just imagining?
however all the japanese men have agreed with the general commentary voiced here.
it would be interesting to look at data that measures the sexual satisfaction of married japanese women.
I beg to differ about the cause of it all. Maybe it is not the wives’ fault. Maybe it is the man – or should I say, the society that he accepts working in. Have you ever heard the hours that those guys work? I worked for a couple of years in a Japanese company myself and I tell you, it certainly had a toll on my sex life. I didn’t get home until midnight and as soon as I did I was hitting the sack. No surprise that salarymen don’t get much action. If Japan is serious about increasing the birth rate then they need to do something about working hours. I’d love to see similar data for investment bankers and consultants in the US. It can’t be far off…
Richmond, You’ve hit the nail on the head. My Japanese husband could have even taught Mitaboy a thing or two before he became a salaryman. Now that he’s working 12 to 15 hours a day, 6 days a week–um…when are we supposed to get it on? Everytime I read articles about the declining birth rate, I just want to shake someone and say, “Duh!”
Yeah for sure..Japanese companies should be ashamed ,too much work and too many hrs a day..I`m suprised that anyone has a baby here…though I`m glad my Japanese wife comes back around 9pm,hey people ,it could be worse as some of you will know ..
Hi,
I am somewhat relieved by what I have read here because I realize I am not alone in my misery.
I have been married for 9 years to a Japanese and live in Tokyo. We have no kids because they don’t make themselves. I get a stale piece of bread about once every 3 – 6 months… For the past year or so my wife is really talking about how much she wants a kid…and has sex once, gets her period, and gets dissapointed only to wait another 3 months before wanting to try again.
I am so dissatisfied with my marriage that I am pretty much glad not to have more ties to my wife at this point. I just want to end my marriage and start over. I have brought up the topic in serious conversation lately but my wife just says something to the effect that marriage is permanent and there is no getting out. Any advice from those who have went through divorce?
Boku
My wife and I met in Tokyo and now live in California. We’ve had this discussion numerous times. Initially I was somewhat pushy and she got defensive. However after 14 years of great marriage and 2 kids we joke about this topic.
There’s no question that Japanese women need or desire sex less than Western women. I have no idea if it’s purely cultural or if there is some biological component. This is on average of course – I’m sure there are many horny Japanese wives too, but they probably can’t cook. Life is full of tradeoffs.
I’ve gotten used to it, or perhaps my testosterone levels have been tapering off. Now I focus on quality, not quantity. If your relationship is healthy then the sex will ebb and flow with your biorhythms. For me sometimes it’s once a week, other times once a month. I don’t really keep track of it or push the issue and she appreciates this attitude, so if I’m patient then eventually she’ll have the energy and inclination and the sex will be fantastic. Earlier I tried a different approach which focused on quantity and not quality. I’d politely ask if I could stick it in (to be crude), and most of the time she would accomodate me but obviously wasn’t into it. After a while I realized that if I self serviced in these situations then she would be more likely to initiate hot sex in the future.
This is an interesting thread. Everybody’s situation is different. I think the bottom line is if you have an otherwise solid marriage, then you don’t enjoy the infrequent sex but you eventually accept it. My advice to Boku above is don’t have a kid until you come to terms with this problem because if it’s only once every three months now, it will be once a year after the kid is born. On the other hand, maybe your wife is the type of Japanese woman who will tolerate her husband having his sexual needs met elsewhere, as long as he’s a responsible father and bringing home the bacon. (More likely the case if you live in Japan than in the US). I doubt that’s what you were looking for in a wife, but it could be an interesting option if she has other wonderful qualities that keep you in love with her. Good luck to everyone!
since it may be unlikely that i’ll meet any of you as i’m in central tokyo, i have a question.
does this issue cut across soci, academic, economic, ethnic lines?
do chinese, korean, spanish, african or african-american men experience these issues regarding sexlessness?
how does the background of the man and the japanese woman factor into this?
Well, the only people in Japan that are sexless are Black people.
Interesting….. so, SecretLurker…. How did you come upon that “intelligent” deduction…?
Secret Lurker,
I’m a black too. I get lots of it. But, I understand what you mean, in the sense that black men make *lurve* – we don’t just “have sex”.
I can only assume that you mean that you are sexless in this way, or that you are insecure brother. If that’s the case, we can’t help you, go home to where you came from, or keep jacking off alone.
i was hoping for more helpful commentary than ‘SecretLurker’s’ # 174, which on the surface seems it may be racist as it isn’t supported at all.
No, “lurve”. I am Black. Japanese people hate Black people. Everyone knows this is a fact.
>>the global average of 103
Good lord. Somewhere there’s someone with a huge grin raising the average at the opposite end of the scale from myself.
i like to feel the cool soft wind in my hair. But when i do the puggle wump churned at me and blasted a fruit filled Belch down my ear.
the succulent beast moaned and moaned as the Geisha girl stood up and it feasted on her every droplet.
i was transfixed. it groaned its flavour and at last the japan girl was throbbed no more.
mitaboy i want to bubble you. at will.
Hi guys! Read all this thread in digestible chunks of course! I’m married to wonderful Masami who’s been living in London for 4 years now leaving there age 30. 4 breaks with convention for her: marrying me, leaving Japan, being creative and of course no wish to return.
So, you may think, pretty well adapted to at least the fundamentals of western ways. Think again – she remains so bone crushingly aligned to home culture that I have marks on my hands where ive tried bending an iron rod of resistance. That said, I chose to marry her so I have no right to spew my liberal and alien ways onto her if they are not wanted.
Yet, shouldn’t one learn to adapt at least an inch or two towards your hosts culture?
This is where the sex comes in: The trajectory sounds yawningly familiar – rabbits before getting hitched, then slow burn to a trickle from there. But my gripe is her absolute blindness to ANY form of contraception other than rubber. Where do I start and do I really have a case here? I mean being married should bring certain privileges and compromises shouldn’t it? The bedroom is place these apply I think.
So I ask you guys – how does one put the case convincingly, with empathy for her point (just as a lever you understand) – in short, what’s the smartest way to get in the sack without having to sell my soul or visit Boots every week.
London, that sounds as though you two have got it the other why around. My memories of J-girls were that I always wanted to use the rubber and they never did.
As to your question, did she say why? (eg. is she afraid of an STD or something?)
this is reprinted here with permission:
[It’s almost laughable to hear foreign men talk about the sexual times they had with their Japanese spouse before marriage, and how now sex seldom occurs. These men are shocked and angry. Haven’t they realized that though many Japanese women appear sexy and attractive that they aren’t nearly as sexual as Western women? The statistics are everywhere; Japanese people don’t have sex as frequently as other cultures.
So what happened?
Japanese women are as smart as most women; they realize that one way to catch a man is through his penis. That means sex is bait! Japanese women don’t have the bait market cornered, no matter what culture sex has always been a tool to ‘hook’ a man. In many instances, the Japanese woman in fact hasn’t experienced the true pleasure of sex but just gave the foreign man what he wanted, no different than she would have done with a Japanese man. The difference between Japanese and Western women is that Western women may desire sex more frequently—again just look at the statistics.
However, with enough moans of excitement a man can be seduced into thinking he has found real love AND that he is a super lover. Amazing how unaware of the truth some men can be. For most men, the fact is that they aren’t fantastic lovers, so it’s easier for them to get hooked. If you are a man reading this, become a better lover and you won’t be caught by sex. A good lover truly focuses on the sexual and emotional needs of the woman. From the Japanese woman’s perspective, the foreign man is more polite and considerate than the ‘typical’ Japanese man because of his ‘ladies first’ attitude. So she is ‘willing’ to get married, even if the sex isn’t good—after which sex dwindles and the husband complains.
Now that she’s married why should she want sex? She has her husband, a gaijin man, her status symbol and the envy of many Japanese women. Sex wasn’t that good for her anyway. It was bait and it served it’s purpose. Amazing that foreign men don’t realize this fact. Now he’s trapped in a marriage and is angry because the sex has dried up. Wrongly, he faults her and tries to introduce sexual variety, basically what satisfies his fantasies and he hopes will satisfy her. The bottom line is that sex was (possibly)never that good for her in the first place and he didn’t really satisfy nor develop a sexual need in her. Combine this with the time constraints of kids and possibly a job. The woman is just too tired and not interested enough to have sex with him.]
To London – this is a generalization but I think Japanese women tend to be highly sensitive to pharmaceuticals. When we lived in Tokyo, my wife (who was my girlfriend at that time in the mid 90’s) agreed to see a gynocologist in Singapore to get birth control pills. It really messed up her monthly cycles and she became irritable and started gaining weight. She stopped taking them after about a year. Now we have been married 14 years with 2 kids, and in our mid 40’s we don’t need to worry about birth control but I still put on a rubber before ejaculating because she doesn’t like the feeling of leakage. I’m not sure if this is common, but it’s frustrating since judging from porn you’d think all Japanese women want their partner to come on their face.
some of what’s going to be said will seem mean spirited, it isn’t meant to be.
pornography is usually written by men for men(look at the credits). so, why would a man think that, “all Japanese women want their partner to come on their face.”? just because a woman “allows” an activity doesn’t mean she “enjoys” it. it’s porn, don’t think she enjoys it, she was most likely paid(most of it is acting). ask your girl if she enjoys it and watch what her body tells you, do not listen to her words. i haven’t met any women that wants or enjoys cum on her face!
empirical observation: judging by physical appearances and personality, many of the men who marry japanese women have had few sexual experiences in their native country. he comes to japan, “gets lucky” with a japanese girl, gets “pussy whipped”, gets married, then gripes about the lack of sexual intimacy after he realizes she isn’t as “interested”(to what degree was she really interested? read post 184 again) in sex as before.
for any japanese women reading this and thinking, “western men aren’t sexually mature!” you are 100% wrong! men are just men, all over the world(even in japan.
here are the facts. women want sex. men want sex. men and women want sex for different reasons.
please check your dictionary, different does not equal immature, just as different does not equal, “bad”. now, check your dictionary for mature. men are different, women are different, that is life, it is impossible for them to look at life, or mature in exactly the same way because they are different. maybe, we can understand each other better because we are creatures that think, but remember that we are different.
for western men married to japanese women:
a. be honest with your japanese spouse about your sexual desire.
b. for those married in “christian weddings” remember your marriage vows state, “for better or worse”. so this is the “worse” part, tell her about it. you may have to live with it. realize that most japanese people aren’t christians, the wedding is a show, entertainment, and has no moral value, this is true even for many christians.
c. seek counseling together. let her know your dissatisfaction and don’t expect her to change. from limited observations japanese women don’t change their sexual attitudes with their western husbands often. she might change with counseling, but do not expect it.
d. tell her that you will seek sexual satisfaction elsewhere.
e. get a divorce
for unmarried men reading this, do your homework before you marry a japanese woman. expect that your sex life will decline just as statistics indicate. expect it and don’t complain about it.
the better option is to talk about the expectations that every man and woman has of marriage – before you get married. then as two adults you can make a better decision. personally, i try to be focused on my lover’s sexual pleasure first, her pleasure before mine, but i tell her very straight and direct, “if we get married, i will divorce you if our sexual life changes.” if she decides to marry, she knows what my expectations are. be direct with your japanese lover before you get married.
for men and women do your homework before you marry.
japanese women and western men need to study each others culture before they marry. but men should study more and look at the sexual statistics about japan which are quite clear, just about everyone in the world has more sex than japanese. you may want to ask,”why”?
western man have more of responsibility to study the japanese culture because in many cases the Japanese woman living in japan won’t. Having consulted in japan for a while now, it’s fascinating that japanese people don’t ask, “why…?” often enough. perhaps the japanese still think, “it’s japan and the rest of the world. the rest of the world isn’t really that important, we are japanese!”
Mitaboy – I was just being facetious with the face comment. Sorry if that didn’t come across (pardon the puns). It was a lame attempt to make the point for “London” that it’s indeed interesting how pervasive condoms are in Japan. I think everyone reading this would be happy to come *inside* our lovely wives, not *on* our lovely wives.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/20/health/main637523.shtml
I have been married to a Japanese woman for more than 2 years and have children. I do not have the problems you guys are describing but read your posts with a lot of interest.
My view on the marriage is very much echoing Dan’s post #38 here: http://www.gaijinpot.com/bb/showthread.php?t=3170
I think there are many wonderful aspects of a Japanese gf and wife so maybe the sex trouble described in this blog is a bit of a trade off.
Also worth noting, I would argue, Japanese actually have an old culture and a very clear value system. The western countries are confused. This statement is not intended as a big generalization (I know it sounds…) but if you swallow that point it may help to see why it is difficult to appreciate differences is your wife.
Dan’s post fragments
[...You are all approaching this from a Western POV. Isn't it perhaps possible that the women are receptive to their own culture and influenced by the 99% of the people who surround them and enforce typical Japanese views. If you wanted a Western wife, it would probably have been better to stay in ...
...Its a really incredible thing to marry someone from a culture as different as Japan, and I think you must all be very strong to have overcome all the cultural barriers and family problems that are almost certainly endemic... ]
Good luck to all of us.
“Japanese men are as perverted (if not more perverted) than those in other countries”
Yep that’s pretty much true! I’m an aussie woman married to a Japanese guy and i can say he’s pretty much thinking sex 24/7. He’s pretty much ready to go when i say the word so for us, our sex life is not a problem.
I would say our marriage is next to perfect as we never fight and we always express our love to each other, he even says “i love you” every day which most japanese guys never say once in their lives!
I would never consider cheating on him, he’s the only one for me. I also would never consider him cheating on me, to the point where i told him if he did i would do a lorena bobbitt!! And he knows i’m serious about it. I do trust him. He watches his porn videos and that’s about it. I’m against porn really but i figure it’s his culture, and it’s better than him doing something on the sly.
As for the guy who said “When my wife rolls over and says she’s not in the mood for the third week in a row, what else do these girls expect us to do?” you are really cruisin’ for a bruisin mate!!
Have a little bit of compassion, it’s not all about you!!
I’m 35 and my wife 42. We have 2 kids – 6 and 4 and generally lead a good life. But it’s the same story as many of you have already described. We had great sex before marriage but slowly after the first child it diminished. She has never refused but she just doesn’t take any initiative and seems non fused about the whole thing. It makes me feel like I’m doing all the work, showing all the affection and generally I feel unloved. Yep we’ve done the toys and what not but it’s still the same.
I’ve told her that I’m not happy with our sex life and we’ve had talks about it. From what I can gather it seems it’s because of the kids and the stress of life that she doesn’t feel sexy. This is not just a Japanese thing; I think all women get this, no matter what country. Where a man can virtually ‘drop n go’, a women needs the emotional side along with it. If she’s not feeling right it just won’t happen. Women aren’t like us. They need an emotional side to get inspired. For most men, just by looking at there hot wife is inspiration enough! But for a woman it’s a much more complex process.
We don’t go out to restaurants much more and I think she doesn’t feel like a desirable sexy woman that often any more. I think after washing clothes/dishes and constantly looking after the kids all day it takes it out of you. A constant stress all day. For the woman to instantly put that aside and have sex just doesn’t happen. It takes time. A woman needs to feel like a sexual desirable woman before she’ll be coming on to you.
But I’ve noticed that my wife is really hard to talk to. And I have all the problems a lot of you describe. She seems quite closed at times and is not so easy to read as western girls I’ve known. She seems selfish in some ways but in others she’s the most caring and giving lady in the world. She uses the Japanese don’t like da da da line as well. Mysterious is one word that comes to mind. Is that part of my attraction to her?
At the end of the day any marriage takes hard work. And it’s even harder if your from completely different cultures. OK sex is good to start with cause its so different and new and fresh. But then reality comes hitting home. But if you really care for the person you decided to marry this is what advice I offer…
Be patient.
Love your wife and try to understand her by talking about things.
Take her out. wine and dine her. Let her dress in nice stuff. Treat her like a lady. Set up situations that will make her feel special.
Talk talk talk
Give her time to be happy within her self.
Remember these are only my opinions and I’m not saying I’m right. Hope it helps and best of luck.
Wow, this has been a very interesting thread to read.
I wasn’t sure if to post or not. I don’t think I fit into the “wife” category, I’m 20 years old and thus marriage doesn’t seem to be in the near future. I think I must also clarify that we live outside of Japan, although I did live there alone two years (18 until a couple of months ago) and plan to go back next spring to continue with university.
My parents are Japanese and according to my older sister, they haven’t had intimacy since our younger brother was conceived. One of the things I have noticed about them is that mother calls my father “papa” when Western couples call each other “darling” and “honey” and such. I do agree in the familiar/sibling feeling. Even now, with my sister being 24, me 20 and my parents, sometimes I feel we are four siblings trying to raise Tetsuo (10).
When I read the post about Japanese women being aroused by men who are dominant, I felt slightly offended, but then commenting that with my older sister, we realized it is true. Japanese women expect dominant, powerful men. Of course, there’s a line between saying “Turn this way”, which is dominant but respectful, and just yanking women around to do whatever position the man desires, which I would find abusive (men, specially Western, take advantage of us being petite, I feel).
Romanticism is a big deal. Japanese women are aware of our appeal to Western men , especially those who like anime or videogames. I have felt, with certain Western boyfriends I had, that I was just a realization of their “Japanese anime girl” fantasies, and I found that very offensive; which led to a downturn in libido. I suppose this applies to younger men mostly.
But as I was saying, Western men, and specially those not in Japan, where Japanese women are a “rarity” should try to make a girl feel special and unique, create a sense of “union” by elping her with her tasks, as you must know she certainly helps you with yours.
I hope this is of some help.
I would also like to add that I was truly disgusted my Mr.Tibbet’s comments, he reminds me of the reasons my parents gave me to not marry or get romantically involved with Western men.
thanks azu!!
nice to have a japanese woman’s perspective.
you mentioned you live outside of japan and that you’ve only live in japan two years, do you think your thinking is typically ‘japanese’ regarding sex? in what country do you live?
i hope the site’s administrator doesn’t mind(please edit or delete if inappropriate)
it would be interesting to have your perspectives on the articles posted on the site below(an excerpt of which is posted here)
http://www.1001kisses.com/
many of the readers of the above site are japanese women in japan. so you opinion would be interesting.
Hey Azu, are you Azuma too?
What part of Japan are you from?
@ azu (kelly)
No, Azu is a nickname that has a long story :3 My name is Miki. My family comes from Hiroshima.
@ mitaboy
I think my thinking is somewhere between my Japanese upbringing and me being youthful. I think I was brought up as traditionally as my parents could in a foreign country (they even put me into a Japanese school). My views on sex have a large Western influence, but me and my older sister have noticed that things sexually between my parents are very far from active.
For a very long time, I remember, my mother slept on a futon in me and my older sister’s bedroom “in case we had bad dreams”.
Our country is Costa Rica (that’s in Central America, I’m used to people not knowing much about it). This is an Spanish-speaking country, so I take the chance to say sorry if my English seems a little confusing.
About the book, the short part available in the main page had this fragment that caught my attention:
“If a woman likes you then she may want sex. If a woman loves you, her own sexual satisfaction is less important.”
I thought I was the only one like that! My current boyfriend is very worried during sex if he thinks he’s about to reach an orgasm before I do, and I always tell him “don’t worry, go ahead”. I wonder if it’s part of the “submissive Japanese wife/woman”. I’ll ask my older sister to see if she does the same thing.
(I just found where the real articles are he2)
I was thinking while reading some of the articles (it’s midnight here, so I won’t have time to read though today) that one of the problems with sex and Japanese women is that we’re taught, one way or the other, that sex is about “laying perfectly still and let the man do his things” with an occasional moan in the middle. Even when you watch Japanese pornography or even the ecchi anime, Japanese women just lay on bed. Many times, if she decides to go on top, she just moves up and down meekly or waits for the man to move his hips.
One author says that the sexual problem in Japan is all to blame on males. “It takes two to tango” and I believe that in a couple both should make an effort to improve their sexual life.
In the case of many people here, who are male foreigners married to Japanese women, I think women should make an effort to break out of that shell, but in the mean time the men whould make a huge effort to understand that shell (I know it’s hard, I’m from a Japanese family and I can barely understand half of our “cultural quirks”) to help her get rid of some of it.
azu,
you are lucky to have a considerate boyfriend! since he has stated his desire to be sure you are sexually fulfilled teach him how to do it, if he doesn’t already know. just the fact that you can communicate on this level is great. never say, “don’t worry, go ahead”, instead teach him technique and patience.
this board is very interesting to me because i have never experienced a problem of sexlessness with japanese women.
my guess, from what i’ve heard from japanese women is that many to most foreign men aren’t as considerate & sensitive(from a japanese woman’s perspective) as media presents or as they themselves would imagine – it isn’t just culture.
if you have any japanese ladyfriends that read english introduce them to the site so that we can get better insights.
thanks!!
I just dropped on this thread by chance. Scanned a few posts. Decided it was a comedy skit.Read a few more, slowly. My jaw dropped. Its for real? These guys really don’t get it?
on 14 Aug 2007 at 9:56 pm 142
Bingo!
Oh, and “Maybe just drop the word casually in conversation, perhaps when choosing peaches at the grocery store or something”
Huh? You nuts?
1) Just get a good referral to a “brazilian waxing” establishment. Pick a good “no work day”. Put 2 tylenol 3 s in the vitamins you feed her with (you do feed her vits I hope), then go down and hold her hand while she yells.
2)Make a big “thank you” dinner, but don’t do anything
3) Get on the plane to that villa you booked in Thailand. The one with a walled garden so you can walk around naked or do it on the barbecue table without being arrested, and a pool so you can f*** under water. Don’t make a big deal out of sex, just do it and do it well; 2 or 3 times a day.
Take everthing you are likely to need inlcuding 2 tubes of KY jelly for the anal, and a video camera. Shop like hell while you are there for the sexiest clothes you can find. Throw in a good bracelet for fun. Make a game of dressing, undressing. Make lots of other games. Buy a yo-yo, a hula hoop or two, Go to fun parks.
If you have kids make sure they are booked in with mother-in-law and well funded. They’ll survive without you for 2 weeks, probably. If not, you can always make some more.
Don’t drink while you are out there having fun.
Oh,, nearly forgot, you did check the monthly schedule I hope. Avoid it. Just get the dates right.
I hope I don’t offend anyone, but all this stuff about Christianity, about expecting a Japanese woman to take the initiative (they can’t, they have no idea what to do), about …. oh dear God, please help these folks!
I cannot believe Japan is becoming a Sexless society. Maybe in the confines of
marriage. I am getting ready to marry a Japanese woman who LOVES sex.
I believe the porno industry in japan aids in the distruction of the marriage.
Thus causing japan to become a sexless society. The economic “Boom” that Japan
has become is in my opinion one of the causes of the Sexless society.
Couples need to spend more time together in order to strengthen the family.
The destruction of the family causes the destruction of the country. Look at America.
I welcome comments from other “gaijin men” who are married to or are thinking of
marrying Japanese women.
After being maried for 5 years with a japanese woman i can say only one thing, They maybe cute, pretty, sexy and so on…. until they married, i don’t know what is going on and/or why it is happen but they become one of the most useless things on this planet. Take my advice fellows, NEVER marry with a japanese girl. To be bf/gf is fine until judgment day but they are going to change into an evil right after you sign marriage paper.
(dave)
how are you defining ‘useless’?
have you considered separation or divorce?
Hi to all you people out there..
I think being married to Japanese has more problems than just sex..
the whole culture difference is bigger than i thought it would have been
Things like expressing our feelings..I dont think Japanese are very good at that..though i am not saying all are like that..but back to the actual post,I do know how you all feel about sexless marriages..My wifes parents sleep in seperate beds and even though my wife doesn`t agree with them (thankfully we sleep in the same bed) she does have a submissive nature..she will just lay there and if i feel i am going to come she will say it`s ok please come..but i feel i would like like to foreplay and then have intercourse again..
and i do feel a change in sex after we got married..as of now the last time we had sex was 1 and a half months ago..that was never the case before we got married..but i love her and she loves me and we know we have different cultures and outlooks on life and we need to respect that..but that doesn`t make it easy ..anyway good luck to you all out there
as i’ve had opportunities to discuss sexlessness with men and women both japanese and foreigners alike sexlessness appears to boil down to this, sex may be viewed as a necessary activity to get men to marry. many to most japanese women do not enjoy sex as a form of orgasmic pleasure. men basically don’t know how to satisfy the women with whom they have sex. many to most men like to think they know how to sexually satisfy women, but they don’t.
if the woman actually enjoys sex from her own perspective(having orgasms) as opposed to ‘just pleasing the man’ then sexual activity will continue through married life provided that the man lightens workload and stress of home and childcare.
“Oh preeze Mr. Bob Harrisu…preeze lip…oh preeze oh preeze Mr. Bob Harrisu!”
It’s not just japanese women. I have found after being married to a japanese man for 5 years that we have “sexless” periods, they could go on for months if i didn’t make the first move.
When you’ve been married for a while, sex kind of works it’s way down the list. I still want to do it, and when i initiate, yes, then hubby is raring to go. But, i think it boils down to the fact that when you are going out on dates, you have no commitments, you’re only looking to the next date, and what else is there to do reallly? you’re still discovering each other.
After marriage there are other focuses. Buying a house, having kids, renovations etc, it all takes up time.
I also think that hubby doesn’t want to “bother me” with his needs, which i’ve told him is totally fine. I think alot of people have an image that japanese men want to do it all the time, if they can, but when you grow up, alot more things come in first place than sex. It doesn’t mean you love each other any less, and it means that anniversary sex is the best sex you’ve ever had! haha
Just kidding… i’m far from that “wife who doesn’t want to have sex” i’m the kind who’s always wants to do it, but, i respect my husband. I know he works hard and long hours, 6 days per week, and i don’t just jump his bones the minute he walks in the door.
The guys who complain about japanese women not having sex, or just laying there, or being totally useless, well helllooo?, that is their culture mate. They were brought up to please men, that’s the society they grew up in, and of course, man is #1 in the household, so she’s trying to please you, whatever you want.
But another thing is, if you don’t tell her what you want, she won’t know will she?
Do you enjoy your wife’s company, is what i would like to know? Are you only all about sex or do you actually enjoy your wife in other ways? Saying she is useless is a bit harsh. She might think the same thing of you! And in what way is she useless? I too, would like to know. I’m sure she cooks you dinner every night and makes a nice home, that is far from useless.
Just my two cents, but i wouldn’t label japanese women into a sexless box, because japanese men are like that too, but it all depends on the situation and lifestyle, and their childhoods, but i would just recommend that if you want a sex object, go to a prostitute, don’t bother marrying someone, you will never be happy.
Cheers
In the comments (I did not read them all, but most) it seems the woman is the problem in the relationship. I, as a woman, have similar problems. My last two relationships involved men who were unable to keep me happily satisfied. One was Japanese and the other American.
I cannot really define the reasons behind it though. I certainly do not lie back like a dead fish and do nothing, but more than one person has told me they thought one might have preferences the other way.
I have heard stories like mine from other women. Whether it is true or not… girls will sometimes say what other girls want to hear.
Hello, everyone. I’m new here.
I agree with azumarisan. You have to COMMUNICATE with your wife if you don’t want a divorce. How about taking her out on a romantic date? You could get her sexy lingerie. Tell her she’s sexy and excites you. Tell her you love her but you need more intimacy in your marriage. Tell her what you need. She has to know. (don’t force her, just make your point and be patient. ) Good luck everyone!
Great point, Yuri.
I was trying to figure out a remedy for the relationship with my boyfriend and found this discussion….they were very interesting.
Honestly, I was somewhat relieved becasue I was not the only one who has the intimacy problem, but at the same time, I was a little dissapointed because it dosn’t seem that there are easy solutions. But, we have to be positive!!
I am Japanese woman and my boyfriend is American, we met in the U.S. and we’ve been together more than four years. My boyfriend told me that he hasn’t been satisfied with our intimacy and he wanted to separate….there are some other reasons for the separation, but the intimacy thing is one of them…We have been discussed this issue so many times….over and over again….he wanted to have sex everyday, he wants to come back to someone who is beautiful and happy to see him…I totally understand what he says….I would like to do so, I would like to see a guy who is handsome, fit and charming…..I would like to have some intimacy with him, but unfortunately, I have to admit that my body is not ready for this every single day.
He accused me that I don’t love him as much as he loves me, but I strongly believe that this is a biological, hormonal or a cultural issue…..I love him, I care about him, but I do not need sex as much as he does….it’s sad….but it’s true. I don’t enjoy having sex with him as much as he does, but I enjoy having sex with him (if he believes it or not)……I might not like it as much as he likes, but I like it, I don’t hate it (if he believes it or not)…. I just do not need sex every single day as he needs…I am always less than him…..maybe “extremely” less than him from his point of view….
I accept what he wants, so it’s OK for me to have sex as a kind of duty as long as he can be satisfied. But he doesn’t want me to think that way…that is a great thing about him….but it makes us feel more sad…I think he understands this difference, but he seems like he doesn’t want to accept it, he doesn’t want to give it up. I don’t expect he will give up, but nothing I can do so far.
I have been tring to find where this problem comes from…I grew up in Japan, and I am sure that my parents haven’t have the intimacy for a long time..so I haven’t exposed to “Western” concept of intimacy until he made me realize there is the difference exsists and he haven’t been satisfied with it.
Maybe I should go to the counseling, but I doubt that it is going to give me a fundamental solution.
nagoyan
no, you do not need counseling, he does. it’s his job to understand you from your sexual perspective. men and women are different. you will see some aspects of this japanese/westerner sexual divide covered in the site posted in comment 192.
cut your losses before you read about his experiences with you from his perspective on this site.
there are no easy solutions. but realize that it is seldom possible, if wise to change for someone else. you are you. thankfully i’ve not had this as an issue in my life because i inform japanese women of my sexuality of 3 to 5X a week very early in the relationship, usually before our first sexual encounter.
I think mitaboy is right – cut your losses. Without knowing your age, I would add before you waste your best years of life forever. He, perhaps may just needs an attractive plastic blow up instead.
He may be handsome, fit but that alone means nothing. I think most “westerners” would like to have sex with an available charming, nice, exotic looking, feminine Japanese young women but for most that is where things end. If she is available daily that’s great for them/him. But makes no difference to the (poor at this moment) relationship outlook for you.
I guess what I am saying it is easy to use Japanese women…
I think you need to look beyond the superficial and find a person who also appreciates you and your absolutely unique and fantastic cultural emotional and value system background. I know this sounds scary but the truth is your options to find a right partner outside of Japan, e.g. in US are far more narrow that an average American girl’s. A lot of these handsome, fit would not be worth your time – they may not even notice you are different, not to mention understand or desire or appreciate the difference.
Look at their cultural background, who their family and friends are. Try not get stuck with time wasters. Hope you find your great match. White is not always best
I have been married to a lovely woman from Tokyo and we have kids. We live outside of Japan. Oh, and I am very very happy with the relationship. Love it!
kornik
I think my boyfriend is very appreciative….he appreciates my uniqueness and what I have done for him. He likes me because I am not like typical American girls. I appreciate his efforts to understand me since my English skill was not enough to express and explain my feelings well.
He is coming from Mexican family and he is educated. I can see that Mexican families are full of love all the time, they show love, affection and passion (especially this) for someone they love…if you watch Mexican dramas, it’s very obvious because the stories expand in their bedrooms..while Japanese dramas barely show their bedrooms. So I understand the difference and I accept that. That’s the greatest thing of understanding different culture and each other.
What I am trying to say here is that if we appreciate the cultural difference and each other’s uniqueness, why can’t we appreciate the differences in intimacy…..maybe it is difficult because men’s and women’s brain are just different as “mitaboy” mentioned. But I think it should be able to overcome…(I hope so).
My boyfriend told me what type of intimacy he wanted from the beginning, and I understood it. But my body doesn’t react the way we want. So I think understanding and any type of agreement do not always remedy the situation. I won’t rush to find the solution, but I am not sure he can torelate to discover the solution with me for a long time….
Nagoyan
I think the problem you are describing a lot of couples around the world would subscribe to!
In time, things around intimacy & differences in your needs will change. Men go over the hill in their twenties. Your problem may solve itself
Wish you all the best.
kornik
Thanks!!
Hi everyone, this is a great discussion, I’ve got a lot out of it so far. I’d like to extend a warm welcome to the Japanese women who recently started commenting here, it’s very useful (and interesting) to hear your opinions.
Regarding the issue of libido, we all want the perfect relationship, which includes a partner with the same sex drive that we have. But nothing in life is perfect and compromise must be a part of any relationship. If your body will not cooperate with your desires, no amount of wishing is going to change that, and I think your partner has no choice but to accept it. Sex is a physical activity, and everyone has their limitations.
The solution which seems fairly obvious to me is masturbation. But a lot of western guys have resistance to this. Some kinds of Christianity still teach that masturbation is wrong. Some guys think that only penetrating a woman makes you a man, so masturbation makes you less of a man. Some guys even consider it a homosexual act.
Sex with your lover will always be better. But it’s not fair to ask for more than they can give. I think it’s wonderful that Nagoyan has tried to accommodate her BF, she has shown him that she cares about him and I think he has a lot to be happy about.
Many men here have talked about their wives being extremely passive in bed. I have experienced this and wondered about it. I think that to some Japanese (and perhaps many), sex is not viewed as a mutual, reciprocal act. It is viewed as something a man does to a woman, for his pleasure, at her expense. Have a look at post 142, by borninloxley. “You really are the lord and master”. “Dont give her the option, tell her what to do sexually”. I assume the writer is not Japanese, but I think he has expressed views held by many Japanese people, both men and women. They believe that the pleasure of a woman is not something that a real man would concern himself with, because women experience the most pleasure from giving it to a man. What motivation would a woman have to actively try to please a man like that? He’s going to do whatever he wants anyway, so why not just save your energy and let him get on with it?
I think many Japanese women have the expectation that when it comes to sex, they are going to be treated like an inanimate object, and so they act like one. And they have the expectation that their lover is not going to be too concerned about their pleasure, so they don’t expect to enjoy sex very much, and are not very interested in it.
Some guys have said here that getting them to respond is just a matter of giving them enough orgasms. I used to think this too, but what it fails to take into account is that when people have strongly or deeply held beliefs, they tend to only be aware of things that fit in with those beliefs, and ignore everything contradictory. So the fact that a woman is experiencing good sex does not necessarily mean she is going to expect to have good sex in the future. If she really believes that sex is boring, she is going to see the good times as a momentary aberration that will soon pass.
So I think that a frank discussion about expectations is necessary to reach some sort of accommodation. I don’t think it is a matter of forcing western values on a foreign culture, because until 40 or 50 years ago these ideas were unheard of in the West, and they caught on anyway. I think the same thing is happening in Japan and will continue to happen.
james
agreed on all points. you mentioned ‘many japanese women’ some might be tempted to lean toward ‘most’.
though this discussion doesn’t reflect my experience, letting the japanese woman in one’s life know that the feeling of sexual pleasure shouldn’t be an aberration to their held values on sex is key. with this expectation she will give you subtle cues when she’s ready and be more open to your desires.
being open is key. however, it is incumbent upon the man to begin the dialogue in a non-threatening manner.
I am the boyfriend of Nagoyan and I would like all of you to here my side of the story and hopefully give a better understanding of the situation. First and foremost I would like to point out that we did indeed ended our relationship after more than four years. However, I do feel that both of us thought that the break up was eventually going to happen.
Being with someone is not about acceptance. Its about love, love is the easiest thing in the world and if it becomes difficult then you are not in love and it is a mere act of tolerance. Nagoyan messages made me sound like one track type of guy, but nothing could be further from the truth.
After the third month of our relationship everything began to decline rapidly. Our intimacy and enjoyment began to take a back seat to out academic lives. Although I always percieved that a relationship would be a stress release from the daily grind of being a student, Nagoyan thought that being in a relationship was just another task that had to be completed. I feel in this case I recieved someone with an excess of emotional baggage. That baggage was passed on to me.
I always wanted to be the perfect guy, I wanted to be intelligent, fit and be the best guy I could be for her. However I never got that from her. I remember that I wanted her to dress better and become happier, to have her live up to her potential and for awhile she was. All the money I made went to her in improving her appearance. We dined at the some of the most expensive restaurants in the state and the ice she recieved was second to none.
I began to think that she was having confidence in herself and that this could be the one for me, however when she returned back from a trip to japan. Her mother destroyed her confidence along with her self-esteem. Everything went downhill from there. I tried to discuss it but she would agree to chance but it was nothing but lip service. She always said she would, but she never did. I tried to take her shopping again but the clothes she chose were extremely masculine.
To top it off, she ended up kicking me out of her apartment when she decided to take her roommates side who she had known for less than month, and she was my girlfriend for more than three years. I think that incident was really the beginning of the end. I knew that you cannot make people change and it was my fault for wanting to realize her potential.
The rest will be continued in the next message:
to james
and the administrator
would like to email james directly if he’s interested
Eliottsan
[I remember that I wanted her to dress better and become happier, to have her live up to her potential and for awhile she was. All the money I made went to her in improving her appearance.]
having modeled and been in retail sales, i’ve discovered that women don’t generally change their fashion sense for the men in their lives. it’s developed in their teens and perhaps early twenties. the styles they she may have chosen while you were with her weren’t in her reality of self esteem.
look for the woman that already has the fashion sense you desire.
[I knew that you cannot make people change and it was my fault for wanting to realize her potential.]
great observation! you can only coach those that want to be.
*it’s ‘interesting’ how these two discovered the same site. simply good fortune?
To Mitaboy and the administrator, please give Mitaboy my email.
To Eliottsan, thank you for sharing your story,I think there are lessons there for all of us, and I’m glad we are hearing both sides of it. I am sad for you and Naogyasan because breaking up is hard. But sometimes it is the right thing to do. I was surprised to learn it had happened, because it seems that the two of you care about each other and have good communication.
I can relate to your story because I have had big problems with my girlfriend. We have worked through them so far. You mentioned Nagoyan’s mother, it’s somewhat shocking to me how brutal Japanese family life can be. I think that as their partners it’s important for us to understand the many pressures that the Japanese live with, and provide support where we can.
The insecurity about appearances is another factor that we need to be aware of. I once saw a girl refuse to stand in front of a mirror because she didn’t want to look at herself. I have no photos of my girlfriend because she won’t let me take them. While it’s good to compliment them on their appearance, I think that if you want to help them feel confident, in the long term it’s best to de-emphasise the importance of looks. Their fear comes from an intuition that their lives are governed by something over which they have little control. So I try to pay more attention to what girls do than what they look like. As Aristotle wrote, “courage [and confidence] is an awareness of your own power”.
original post from james
[The solution which seems fairly obvious to me is masturbation. But a lot of western guys have resistance to this. Some kinds of Christianity still teach that masturbation is wrong. Some guys think that only penetrating a woman makes you a man, so masturbation makes you less of a man.]
in fact for many men they are just masturbating anyway when they have sex with a woman, just pleasuring themselves – no different than masturbation.
this fact hit home when my girlfriend asked me if i could have sex with a 75 year old woman. let me say that my girlfriend has a great sense of humor and we talk about everything, she usually uses stories.
anyway i said depends on the woman’s fashion sense, how in shape she was and intelligence, i exercise, am fashion conscious, and like to talk after sex. i then asked her if she could have sex with a potbellied man of 75. she said yes, because she could just lay there. basically sex would just to be a task to be fulfilled as part of a relationship. this is what japanese women are used to. they aren’t used to a man caring about their sexual satisfaction.
perhaps it should be said that my girlfriend is a different from other japanese women in that she’s a business owner. she has told me several times that sex helps to reduce stress from her business day.
this is the woman that i’ll probably marry.
a very important aspect of our relationship is that we talked about sex before we had sex. i was honest and direct about my expectations 3 – 5 times a week and that her pleasure was before mine, there were no surprises.
many men will roll their eyes at this, but, learning to give a good massage(20 minutes minimum) helps prepare women for sex. you’ll never been turned down from a massage, or the sex after.
Story continued:
So as time went on she began to dress even more masculine. When I had to attend donner parties I practically had to force her to wear something that looked like it had some sort of femininity. I was looking for the housewife type of woman. One who would be devoted to her family and her husband.
While she said she was that type of woman I never saw the action. Intimacy always felt like it was forced so it was such a turn off there were many nights we ended up doing nothing because I dont believe in forcing anyone to do something they dont want to do and guys that do that are just pathetic!!!!
The passion and love I felt for her was never returned. I felt like if I got kidnapped she would do nothing to find me. I think for her she thought that I was going to accept her the way she was because we had been together for so long. But I warned her that I was not going to. She did not want a japanese relationship, but she was acting like we were in a japanese relationship, (the shut up and take it sort of way!). I adore japanese women, but I will never be a japanese man. Nagoyan was the type of girl that if everything was fine on her end then automatically everything must be fine on my end, but again nothing could be further from the truth.
So the best thing to do was to cut both of our losses and end it….
To Eliottsan
Sorry to hear the relationship is over.
You can’t change a person. If you knew that before… what you were doing might had been, in a way, unfair to her. Perhaps, try to chose a person you do not have to change next time. Other that, I am sure you and she gave the best efforts but they would seem unfortunately not aligned.
“I adore japanese women”
Well, perhaps you should re-examine that.
(1) My Japanese female friends explained to me some differences between generations of Japanese women. If you believe that, it may be the case that the really feminine ones are now in their late forties and fifties – these are the very traditional women who would own and wear a dozen or more of kimonos, know the culture and language very well. Somewhat opposite is the generation now in their twenties – these young women have been very influenced by the commercialized reality, may know little of the tradition and often may have difficulties in handling the subtleties of their own language. “I was looking for the housewife type” – well your future choices may be limited.
(2) In Japanese tradition there is something you may not like as a westerner. It is a virtue to be able to live with difficulties sometimes big ones, maybe even accept them, but still remain happy and very sane. (A traditional) Japanese is much better emotionally equipped to survive hardship because they expect hardship. A Japanese woman may accept a problem as a challenge and live with it. You may need something closer to perfection.
Mita-boy,
I can’t believe that you are considering marriage! That’s great. Although the cynic in me does want you to come back to this forum a few years after you’ve tied the knot to see if things remain the same…
Many people seem to enter into relationships hoping to “change” their partner in some way. It’s never this easy because although people naturally change and grow on their own, it’s difficult and often resisted if *you’re* the one trying to do the changing.
I have a relative lack of experience in relationships, so although I *definitely* know what kinds of women I find attractive, as far as personality and behavior goes I’m very open. In spite of love for her family and cooking, my girlfriend is pretty unconventional – instead of slaving away at college for four years before becoming and office lady and eventually getting married, she’s in music school and wants to become a pro musician. Heck, she already sings and plays live with her band regularly. Now most guys wanting a Japanese girlfriend might give her a try, but end up breaking up and discouraged when they find out she’s not going to be the quiet, dainty, obedient housewife they lust for. But I’m determined to love my girlfriend for who she is, and I’m quite ready to follow her and her ambitions for her life, regardless of how they turn out, because I know she’s a very special person and worth the risk. If I tried to “change” her aspirations, or her sense of fashion, or whatever else, then the relationship would be doomed because she is not a weak, submissive stereotype girl. So I think the lesson is to avoid entering in a relationship with someone if you can’t love her for who she already is.
Another part of it is that while you can’t change the other person in most cases, you can change yourself, and if you perceive a girl as worth the effort, than you can alter your own lifestyle for her sake. But if doing so will only make you miserable, it’s probably better to avoid it. For a sufficiently impressive girl, I would try to be flexible in this area, but careful – you don’t want her to think you’re some sort of easily-manipulated girly man.
i found this site because I live in a sexless marriage with my japanese wife. not to brag, but to prove a point, i have been considered extremely attractive all my life. I have literally had my choice of women, and I chose this japanese girl because she was very nice (not really overly attracted to asians). Well, here I am. Top of the class. bringing in 7 figures. handsome. yet i am in a completely sexless marriage. My wife was taught that sex was bad…so this article seems to be misleading in the beginning. Perhaps the new generation of japanese are more libereral in their sexual openness, but my wife was taught never to have sex. so much so that she doesn’t have sex even in a marriage. I’m really quite sick of it to be honsest. In fact, I may be done with it. Next wife (if any) definately not japanese. or asian for that matter. a nice blonde please.
Getting involved with a non-Japanese woman is no guarantee of a happy relationship. Least of all a blonde, blondes are trouble
I presume you expressed your view that sex is fun, and that many people enjoy it. What did she say to that? I also presume that you made some attempt to satisfy her sexual needs, how did she respond to that
i am a canadian and i have a japanese boyfriend who doesnt seem to be interested in sex. he starts then stops. i tried to talk to him but hes dismissive.
The way I see “sex” as Japanese, many Japanese people might not see “sex” as something to enjoy, feel pleasure or a sort of entertainment between people who love each other. Some of them might even think “sex” should not be something to enjoy. Personally, I think sexual intercourse is not the altimate goal of cultivating “Love” between them. Instead, it should be one of the ways of creating love, “Make Love.”
I am trying to think of how my notion of “sex” was created, and I think one of the reasons might be the influence of Japanese adult videos or Japanese sexual industry. As you know, Japanese adult videos are projecting very negative image of sex; assault, perverted, no emotion of love, passiveness for women, pleasure only for men, etc…they do not show the real “give and take” and “communication” at all. When I watched those videos first time, I was really shocked. “That’s crazy, that’s ridiculous!!” At that time, I am sure I was still virgin. Imagine, how powerful that experience was and how it could effect on my notion of sex? I believed that they were not projecting the way it should be, but then, how and what the way should be? How should I express my emotion during making love? Then I got confused, “Are they the real ways that usually people are supposed to do?”
I tried to look for the good examples of “making love,” but nobody (no Japanese) showed me the good examples. My parents? No way!! I am sure that they love each other, but I’ve never seen their physical contacts (hugs and kisses) in my life. (This might be the reason that I believe “Love” can exist without sexual contacts between married couples.) Also, I was even taught that any types of physical contact with family members would be considered as inappropriate behaviors when children reached a certain age, around 11 or 12. In other words, how can I express my feelings and emotions of love if I’ve never seen those behaviors around me? if it was not allowed to show those type of emotions?
Maybe Hollywood movies, which you can watch in Japan, can be a little good examples. I remembed that I had longed for the relationship like Hollywood “love commedy” movies, whcih are restricted to show sexual actions but showed romance that Japanese usually don’t have, when I was a teenager. Fortunately, I think that the exposure to Hollywood movies made me believe that Japanese adult videos were crazy and I still want to have relationship with foreigners. But the reality was that, my partner told me “boring” or “I don’t feel anything,” and I realized that I wanted to have the intimacy with foreigners like movies, but I didn’t have any skills to show my emotions in bed. I have never expressed my emotions like people in the movies. I had a lot of hesitation and felt embarrassment expressing myself in bed at the beginning, but after a lot of practices with my partner’s (Eliottsan) support, I got used to it.
Back to the notion of sex, my notion that I used to have in deep inside was that pursuing “pleasure” equals doing like Japanese adult videos. Japanese adult videos are ridiculous; therefore, pursuing “pleasure” is a kind of ridiculous. Fortunately, I don’t feel that way anymore, but I believe that lack of exposure to a sound sexual behavior can really impact on creating the notion of sex. Understanding and behaving are two different things. I understood that expressing “love” for someone is not a bad thing; but when it comes to behave it, I was anxious about doing something forbidden. Besides, Japanese people are usually not good at expressing themselves, that is why Japanese young figure skaters, pianists and athletes are willing to go to other Western countries to learn how to express themselves.
I think that some Japanese people might need to feel secure in order to discard their negative notion of sex and to practice to express their emotions physically.
hills-zoku
thanks! not married yet, but being discussed. have been married before, thankfully sex wasn’t an issue. the day i made up my mind to go ahead with the divorce she asked if we could still have sex. i said, “no’ of course. we are still friend’s.
to the post of 224
“jap” is offensive.
if you don’t have children get a divorce. if you have children take them with you out of the country. guard them carefully because once with the mother you may never see them again, but that is another topic
Nagoyan
“wanted to have the intimacy with foreigners like movies, but I didn’t have any skills to show my emotions in bed” – both Japanese and Hollywood movies are fairytales for adults. Fantasy for masses wanting to feel good voting with their wallets. Really bad choice to try to model yourself unless you want to badly screw your mind.
“I believe “Love” can exist without sexual contacts between married couples” – of course it can but:
– in love or not in love. So it gets to our choices what we do. Choice one would hope is influenced by our “love”.
1 for man sex is everywhere
2 suggest always try to find a boyfriend with an emotional IQ same or higher than you.
3 more likely in the 2nd phase of love… after the infatuation, after brain’s hormonal imbalance goes away. Some say this takes 9 months.
Perhaps read something meaningful about perceptions of love … one I would highly recommend is “The road less traveled” M Scott Peck.
Nagoyan, I have been reading your posts with great interest, and appreciate very much that you share your thoughts here. For some of the guys on this page (yes, including me) this is a really serious issue, one which many can’t seem to fathom or overcome even after a long time trying. What you said about the Japanese pornography industry is true, and when Japanese girls get their first (twisted) taste of the “role” which they are meant to play in sex, I can easily see how it would put them off engaging in it.
I mean, let’s face it, (and even Mitaboy has to agree with me here) Japanese girls get objectified more than any other race in the world. Subjectively (correct me if I’m wrong, with your reasons!), on the outside, they are the most beautiful women in the world. The dark shiny hair, the slightly tan skin, the sleek and slender bodies, the knowledge and means to keep themselves looking and smelling good, and those mysterious eyes! What man could resist? I know I couldn’t. And it wasn’t because I fell in love with these girls I was meeting, it was just because I wanted to have sex with them for these superficial – but extremely seductive – qualities which they possessed. That whether I like it or not, is objectification – the portrayal of girls as mere instruments of sex. Japanese guys and foreigners do it alike, albeit for different reasons. Japanese men do it by their nature (too much weird j-porn in their malleable chugaku years), and Western men do it to fulfill their oriental-submissive-Japanese-maid-anime-otaku fetishes and fantasies.
How to get from that stage of objectification to a loving relationship with reasonably sustainable sex is a HUGE hurdle, which is more than often grossly underestimated. For me, it was a big step, and I still am struggling to get through my sexless periods one at a time (I am not completely sexless yet, but if my wife had her way, we likely would be!).
So, Nagoyan, I would like to ask you (or any other Yamato-nadeshikos out there) a question:
Now that you know that many (all?) men initially look at Japanese girls purely as objects of sexual gratification, or a means to fulfill their “anime fetish” (don’t take that the wrong way – it is only in the first stages until we actually care for the person who lives inside the sexy body), what do you think has to happen for the average Japanese girl to become a fox in bed, and more importantly enjoy it, and stay that way after marriage? Do you think there is any hope at all? I ask this knowing how it must sound, and that it may even come as a shock to you, but all the same, it is very real and certainly an honest and sincere question.
Dear Admins, could you remove or edit the word “Jap” in posts above? It is definitely not appropriate, and could trim someone’s notion to comment here, and we would all miss out then.
Removed the offensive words in posts above. No place for it here. Great discussion happening, let’s not destroy it.
Get the torches out…
Japanese women do get objectified, agreed. Perhaps more than most women.
Let me paint a target on myself because I’m guilty of the same. Though I don’t think the criteria for selecting women in Japan has changed much from my process in Southern California. I’ve always chosen women based on their sense of fashion and whether or not they took care of their hands and feet. Looks, as defined by facial structure, hairstyle, and weight factored in to lesser degree. The reason that they factored in to a lesser degree is that we all look ugly when we get older.
What wins me over with a woman is her intelligence and sense of humor. Elements such as fashion sense and how a woman cares for her body gives me an indication of what she thinks of herself. But her ability to discuss issues and topics below the surface is what locks me in. Attractive women in Japan are a dime a dozen, intelligent women aren’t. The women in my life have all known that I can date an attractive woman easily, not a big deal for me. They know that they are chosen. I’m not an easy lay. I once stopped dating a woman because she read a newspaper article, said it was interesting, I asked her to explain to me why she thought it was interesting, she couldn’t answer even in Japanese, we stopped dating. My tolerance for the inability to express oneself is extremely low.
From a sexual perspective and I think this is where many men err is that they may(I don’t know this to be true) have too much of a pornographic image of sex while engaged in the act. I monitor several website that deal with sexual issues with Japanese women and it’s incredible to realize just how ignorant so many men are. Hint: generally speaking, removing your penis and falling asleep within seconds of having an orgasm or trying to ejaculate all over a woman’s face isn’t her idea of making love.
The reason that I haven’t suffered the issues that are posted on this site is that I genuinely care whether or not the woman that I am in bed with is really sexually pleased. This is not a question in my mind but should be a question in most men’s minds. As I think I’ve stated somewhere on this site I was married before, now divorced, sex wasn’t an issue. My ex-wife asked me whether or not we could still have sex even though we were going to be divorced. Answer, “No!”
Pleasing a woman means from her perspective first, before my own, all the time. For me her pleasure is my pleasure. I make this known all the time. And it seems to shock women all the time that I care. Sex, 3 to 5 times a week is no problem, because she knows she is in for a pleasurable time. Is it just a question of technique, “No!” though that plays a large part of it, and I’d say well over 70 to 80% for most men. The other aspect is showing that you genuinely care about your woman verbally and physically.
I’ve taken the time to study how to sexually please women. I studied it, most men haven’t studied. Many men think by virtue of the fact that they have a penis, watched some pornographic movies, they can please a woman, far be that from the truth. I’ve been stunned by the words women have used to describe how i make them feel, but I’m not surprised by their thoughts because I studied. Surely some men are thinking, “Who the hell does he think he is to say what he’s saying?”
Let me put it in a different perspective. In your profession, you know your level of competence by the preparation you’ve made to be successful. Having a great sex life is no different. Most men aren’t prepared and in many cases don’t deserve the sex that the woman is “giving” them, just because many Japanese women believe that sex is a “duty” in a relationship. Many American women will leave men if the sexual performance is sub par, Japanese women generally don’t.
It also seems a little bit too easy for many foreign men to allow Japanese women to fall into the subservient role of cooking, cleaning and generally becoming a servant. I cover these issues to some degree on my 1001kisses site. None of the Japanese women in my life have ever been asked to cook or clean for me. They’ve sometimes cooked for me on their own volition but it has never been required. They know that with me that we are equals. I often remind them that I’m NOT a Japanese man and I don’t need a maid, mother, or prostitute to perform pornographic movie urges. I actually can and cook clean better than the average woman. I’m interested in a companion.
Light the torch ha hah ha
f_gaijin,
I don’t think Japanese girls get objectified more that any other race. I think Western girls experience exactly the same thing, and in some ways things are worse over here because our mass media is saturated with sexual imagery. Japanese media is quite tame in comparison, and they pretty much never show scantily clad women on TV, let alone actual nudity. Western girls don’t get fetishised and treated like an exotic commodity (at least, not by Western men), but they definitely get treated as providers of sexual services above all else.
You made some unfortunate choices of words. You wrote “the person who lives inside the sexy body”, as if the body and the person can be separated. This is objectification, and I am sure you want to eliminate such processes from your thinking. Language determines thought, if you don’t want to think this way, don’t write this way.
It also might be a good idea to think carefully about what you actually want. What does it mean to become “a fox in bed”. You listed it as a separate outcome from “enjoying it”, so it sounds like you are talking about getting your own needs satisfied. Which would make the question “how can I get a girl to enjoy satisfying my needs”, which leaves out her needs entirely, and that’s clearly the wrong attitude.
In my opinion there are only two important questions.
1. What can I do to give my woman sexual satisfaction?
2. How can I introduce the idea of mutual and reciprocal pleasure to someone who has never experienced it?
There are dozens of websites devoted to the first question. The second is what we have been discussing here, and I think the length of the discussion attests to the difficulty in answering it. It all comes down to communication, and I think patience and persistence is vital. Also listening to and learning from your partner, respecting their views and taking them seriously.
Dear Nagoyan,
Your post was thoughtful, very insightful, and quite touching. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. It was quite illuminating for me to read about the influences your parents had on you, because I would think that their views are quite common across Japan. Also your exposure to pornography (and your reaction to it) is probably quite a common experience for both Japanese and Western girls.
I wonder what kind of security is needed for Japanese people to feel comfortable expressing their emotions physically. I guess they would need to feel free to try doing new things without being judged or compared unfavorably with other people? That they would not lose their partner\’s respect, that their partner will not be critical of their efforts. Maybe it comes down to simply feeling that they know how their partner is going to react to what they do.
I was surprised and a little bit overwhelmed by many responses to my post…but, I can definitely say that I enjoy writing on this site because the discussions really make me think so many things, and I am glad that people respect my thoughts.
To f_gaijin,
I have never married, and because of the intimacy issue, I had to break up with Eliottsan (above). So, I cannot give you any advices, but I hope that we could share some helpful views to understand the intimacy issue between Japanese people and foreigners.
mitaboy said very interesting things about Japanese girls in 232;
“…her ability to discuss issues and topics below the surface is what locks me in….I once stopped dating a woman because she read a newspaper article, said it was interesting, I asked her to explain to me why she thought it was interesting, she couldn’t answer even in Japanese,…”
I am not a linguist, but I think this problem comes from the way of thinking process that Japanese people have. I used to have this type of problem when I started going to English conversation schools (Eikaiwa) in Japan (I think I still have it). I noticed that English teachers always asked students “how do you feel?” and “why do you think so?,” because they wanted us to practice to use adjectives, but I had to say “I don’t know” or to keep twisting my neck because I have never thought of “why I think this way.” Those types of question made me annoyed, but I am sure that English teachers were also annoyed since Japanese students even cannot explain their own thoughts and feelings. So I understand why mitaboy’s ex-girlfriend said so and why mitaboy thought that way.
When I took English writing courses in American university, professors always put red marks on my papers, “explain more.” English is a type of language that we have to assume that we don’t know who is going to read your paper, so you have to explain details in order for everybody to understand, and in order to support what you are trying to say. (It is only one of the characteristics of language, but when we learn the different language, we learn more than language. I learned how to express and face myself by learning English.)
On the other hand, Japanese language is very ambiguous. We (among Japanese people) often encounter the situations that we don’t have to describe things, including thoughts, feelings and emotions, precisely to communicate and understand each other (i-shin-den-shin). Also, Japan is (almost) a mono-cultural (ethnic) country and everybody receives the same education and grows up with the (almost) same cultural values. So, people assume that everybody thinks the same way in many situations.
Since it is not necessary to share how we feel about things, I think we even start ignoring own feelings. We might feel something deep inside, but we rarely describe our feelings verbally unless you have a very close friend whom you can share everything about yourself; therefore, we even become unable to explain own feelings. In other words, we might lack of experiences to crystallize our thoughts and might not know ourselves very well compared to foreigners.
In addition, it is considered that it is necessary for us (Japanese) to have the ability to read between lines, which are un-described thoughts, feelings and emotions, and the attempts to read those lines (minds) in order to get along with people. (Whether we actually communicate and understand each other well or not is other story, especially among couples.)
One more thing in terms of Japanese people’s ability to discuss issues;
I think that Japanese people do not have enough experience to create real discussions. If you watched a live broadcast from the Diet (Kokkai Chukei) on TV, which is the meeting of Japanese politics, you will see how woeful Japanese people’s discussions are (basically, it seems that they are just accusing or fighting each other and not productive at all). So I think we do not have enough ability to discuss, which is that foreigners can be satisfied.
Also, it might be the issue of expressing ourselves. When I am in Japan, I always care about what other people might think about me. How they think about my appearance, how they think of my opinion, how they think of my attitude, etc…therefore, it is very difficult for some people to show their opinions because they don’t want to be judged, but I think usually people get used to it as they get older.
Furthermore, my self-esteem has been determined by other people’s judgement (including my parents) for a long time. I noticed this fact two or three years after I moved to the United States. I feel more “free” now, but I cannot discard the value of emphasizing “harmony” completely, which indicates that I care how other people think of me as Japanese.
I haven’t discussed the intimacy issue directly; however, I believe that if you couldn’t express or discuss basic emotions, thoughts and feelings, it is more difficult for some Japanese women to express sexual things. I discussed my personal perspective here; however, everybody is different. I believe that we can overcome the issue of expressing ourselves by practicing. I hope that other Japanese women would support me or bring different perspectives here, but does the fact that there are a few Japanese women drop opinions on this site mean anything??
“gaijin” is just as much an insult as “jap” is but i don’t see the moderator editing it out for us.
I don’t agree with what Nagoyan says about Japanese people having trouble expressing themselves. I know many many Japanese including my husband, male and female, and they all can express themselves even they’ve never been to school outside of Japan. I don’t think they “grow up with the same cultural values”. Everyone has different ideas about what culture actually is, and the fact that you say that you can’t express yourself, is a cop-out, blame it on your country or the society you were born into, but please don’t blame it on yourself, it would be too hard!
Japanese women going out with foreign men is not unique, every second guy i see these days is with an asian girl. They want something different, exotic and unknown but come to this forum with their tails between their legs because it didn’t work out. Gosh. Sorry you expected some kind of inhuman sex-robot…
I also think the basis for your accusations is pretty flimsy. You’re calling Nagoyan a liar because you’ve met “many many Japanese people” who don’t fit in with what she wrote. Well, I think she’s met more Japanese people than you, being born in the country and all. I think you’re jumping to conclusions that aren’t really warranted. If she started lecturing you about Australia, it would seem a little arrogant, wouldn’t it?
As for men wanting sex robots, this seems pretty far from the sentiments that have been expressed here. If you’ve got a point to make then make it. Calling people names does not achieve anything.
James, i said “i disagree” because it is a DISCUSSION. I was expressing my point of view. I did not even say liar in my post once. I was not calling Nagoyan a liar just expressing my view from a stand point. Is that ok or do i have to ask permission?
I didn’t know only white men and Japanese girls could post here.
Oh yes, and you say Nagoyan has met more Japanese than me? If you say so. Cause you’d know wouldn’t you.
I’ve lived in Japan, my family is Japanese and i’ve a pretty good idea what it’s like in Japanese society. Yes it can be pretty excuciating but again it depends on the type of family you’re from. My Japanese family are not that traditional and everyone expresses their opinions pretty freely, both male and female.
My opinion is just as valid as yours, James, so don’t go getting your knickers in a knot.
Sex-robot was in reference to the whole Anime-jap-girl objectification, if someone is going to salivate over jap girls well it’s pretty much a given they are not going to get into the actual person they just want a sex robot to fulfill their fantasies.
Whether Japanese women get objectified or not;
I feel that American women (sorry, I don’t know how’s it like in other countries) get objectified more than Japanese women. Also, it seems that American women sell themselves as sex objects more than Japanese women. This morning, I went to a book store and looked at female fashion magazine section in California. The cover of those magazines lead “Let’s talk about sex…(Vogue)” “The sexiest, prettiest, most flattering looks (Lucky).” We also see other health magazines cover “how to get sexy body” type of things with pictures of bikini women all the time.
On the other hand, if you look Japanese female fashion magazines, they are focusing on more trends, such as the newest handbags of COACH, PRADA, GUCCI, instead of attracting men. I think this fact already shows that “sex” is not important for Japanese female and brand name stuff make many Japanese women happier and those are better than “sex.” I remember that I brought a Japanese female fashion magazine to an English class in American university. The professor showed the class inside of the magazine and asked “what do you think?.” Then, one of the American girls said, “I think they (Japanese women) are covering them up too much.” Her opinion made me laugh and I thought that she got the point.
In this semester, we discussed “sport and the violation of gender” in class, and the professor brought up the issue that (American) women are sexualized in sport. Even in sports magazines, athletes pose sexy look. The bottom line was, “They think that if they can package women athletes in ways that familiar, as sex objects, that they will entertain and sell.” (Michael Messner of the University of Southern California).
I am not quite sure how much American media really project women’s inner thoughts and American women are manipulated by media; however, if American female magazines can be sold more with “sex,” doesn’t it mean that American female have to sell themselves in order to attract men and “sex” is one of the sales points?
For some Japanese women, being “sexy” might mean being like a prostitute or a “mama (hostess)” at snack bar (not a food) in Japan. They wear sexy clothes to attract male customers. Many Japanese people don’t get used to see sexy clothes and accentuated body lines or showing skin, so they over react to it. Sometimes, just wearing skirts get attention from co-workers, especially in country side of Japan, and you have to tolerate middle aged women’s noses; “Why are you wearing skirt today? Are you going to date tonight?”
I think that wearing sexy clothes is ok in appropriate occasions in Japan. But it seems that you have to have confidence because you might have to tolerate other people’s reactions. So go ahead, if you have confidence. (But, sometimes, I feel, I wish I could wear that…very deep inside…because I am a girl.)
I used to feel that the word of “sexy” brought me the impression of being “cheap.” So, when somebody told me “you look attractive,” I felt better than “you look sexy.” Again, maybe it depends on the situations, though.
Yes, when i was in Japan, and it was Summer, i wore singlets and let my lacy bra straps show, which means nothing in a western country, but every Japanese gawked at me and kept staring so i know what you mean about them reacting to it. However, i think if you don’t care about other people’s reactions you can wear what you want, it’s all about feeling happy with yourself.
Western women want to feel sexy and attractive and most of the time it has nothing to do with attracting me, it’s all about the way we feel as women. We are confident in our bodies and we want to feel good about ourselves.
I think the biggest objectifier of women are the women themselves, it is they who buy those magazines with women in sexy poses, if we didn’t think it looked good we would vote with our purses and not buy into it. As women we enjoy seeing other women’s bodies, maybe to compare, or just see beauty in itself. It’s not all about bringing a woman down, the women’s magazines are raising women up, giving them confidence and saying “you too can do this”, giving us confidence in our every day lives.
Sorry that should be *attracting men*
To james,
I think you brought a good point in 233;
“It all comes down to communication, and I think patience and persistence is vital. Also listening to and learning from your partner, respecting their views and taking them seriously.”
I agree. But, it might take extremely long time to get the outcome of your effort. I always feel that even if I took time for explaining myself, foreigners can never understand me completely. Japanese women would compromise easily at this point. So, honestly, I don’t expect men (whether foreign or Japanese) to understand 100 %, but I hope that they would try to understand their partners as much as they can if they love Japanese women. Also, Japanese women have to do the same way. That is mutual. The attitude that they try to understand partners make me “turn-on.” But if you feel it is a waste of your time, you have to leave, because we do not know when you can see what you expect. It might take more than ten years….This can apply to not only inter-racial couples, but also the relationships within the same ethnicity. It might be a good test question.
“I wonder what kind of security is needed for Japanese people to feel comfortable expressing their emotions physically.”
I think your guesses are on the right track, but I cannot say “yes” completely because my partner could not be satisfied….
To azumarisan,
Thank you for your comment. I think your experience in Japan can help to illustrate how Western women and Japanese women react differently very well. I think that it was lucky for you that you did not have any particular feelings to what every Japanese gawked and kept staring at you. If I was in your situation, I would feel that I am doing something wrong. I always try to avoid making that kind of situations by covering up myself, because if I was in a crowded train and a perverted man was getting close to me, I cannot escape. I don’t want to stimulate perverted men.
I have an experience that a perverted man pushed his horny penis onto my butt and started panting beside my ear in a packed subway. I was standing and I thought that other people might have noticed what he was doing, but nobody helped me because they actually couldn’t see what he was doing. I should have shouted but I couldn’t do it because I was scared and confused. I didn’t wear sexy or exposed clothes, but it happened. Since then, I have had to be careful about what I wear. I have to protect myself. Many Japanese women have similar experiences and that is why they made “female exclusive cars” in subway and trains.
I feel that “I don’t care what other people react” in the U.S., but in Japan, sometimes it is difficult.
Thank you for letting me know your view of women’s magazines. You are right that magazines avail to raise women’s confidence. Recently Japanese female magazines use models who won a prize in miss universe or successful women and they are trying to boost Japanese women’s self-esteem. We discussed in a class, why many (American) women want to perform cosmetic surgeries, such as breast augmentation, lipo suction and botox or doing exercise. And we concluded, “women want to look good in naked.” So when do you be necked? The answer is “sex.” That is Western perspective I think. If you asked the same question to Japanese women, they would say that it is because they want to be look good, but they wouldn’t say it is because they want to look good in NAKED.
” I didn’t wear sexy or exposed clothes, but it happened. Since then, I have had to be careful about what I wear. ”
I find this sentence difficult to comprehend. I don’t know why you think you were in the wrong for what you wore, because it is the man on the train who had a problem, not you. It is his fault, not yours. I could never understand your feeling because as a woman i assert myself, and i stand up for myself, and i think i have every right to do the things i want to do in my life, that’s why i am here, so if that man has a problem and did that on the train, even if no-one around you noticed, you did, and why didn’t you shout “hentai!” or “chikan” or something? I’m just wondering is all, because he was in the wrong, and i would have no hesitation in doing that.
We as woman are not lower than men. I think Japanese women have trouble with that idea, but we are not, so if we wear clothes that are sexy and make ourselves feel good, if someone else, a man for instance, had a problem, it is his problem, not ours. If he acts on his attraction it will be his fault for the consequences.
I don’t know about your last sentence, women wanted to look good naked. Maybe they did, but it’s not about being naked. It’s about being comfortable in our own skin, we can wear that bikini and feel good, or the mini skirt. I wear what i like, and i don’t care if my husband likes it or not, if i feel good, that’s the main thing. Of course, i’m going to be sensitive to my husbands feelings and i wouldn’t go wearing something inappropriate like lingerie in the street, but if i feel good about myself, i think people can see that, and they respect you all the more for it.
It’s really hard for me as a woman to accept the way you think, basically because we are taught to stand up for ourselves and take no crap, but you on the other hand feel you have to conform to dressing a certain way so that you don’t excite a man on the train or something, and it’s like, well it feels like you have no rights, and you think you have no rights to dress the way you want to. And it sounds like you think that it is your fault if men are screwed up and look at you in a sexual way.
I think it’s interesting to see what you have to say though and don’t take my comments the wrong way, i’m enjoying having this discussion with you.
To azumarisan,
Thank you for your comment. It was very interesting and funny because I could totally understand your perspective, such that you stand up for yourself, but you don’t understand my perspective. I couldn’t stop giggling. It’s not your fault because the same things happened with my ex-partner; he had similar perspectives just like you. So I kept explaining and explaining to him, but he never understood. So I was not surprised about your comment. What I was surprised was that you had lived in Japan and you have a Japanese husband, but you couldn’t get it. My ex-partner has never been to Japan. Maybe my English was not enough. Let me think for a couple of days to find better explanations. Or if somebody who understand my perspective, please help me here. I think it is something like I can never understand some English jokes even if how much they explained to me. However, if this gap is really critical in the relationship, we have to be serious. Maybe I should have been more serious about this gap when I was with my ex-partner….I mean, I should have looked for better explanations more seriously…
But, I can imagine how great your husband is!! And I enjoy discussing with you, too!!
Japanese women are not accustomed to asserting themselves.. Obedience to authority figures is a very powerful value (for both men and women), people are expected to do what they are told to do by their parents, teachers, the government. If they don’t, they are very harshly punished. So you can really only argue with people of the same social status as you, but confrontation is frowned upon. If you are going to disagree with someone you should do it politely and quietly, so as not to disturb the people around you. In your daily life you should avoid upsetting people around you, even complete strangers.
Confronting a pervert requires a completely different set of skills and attitudes. People have little experience of that kind of social interaction, and it violates a number of norms, so of course women might hesitate before doing it. There is also an issue of physical safety involved, if the man gets angry and you can’t get away from him.
Also, women are expected to subordinate themselves to their husband, which may imply a general expectation that women should be subordinate to men in general. Certainly, assertiveness is not a feminine value in Japan. Positions of power are generally reserved for men, women are not supposed to exert their personal power, that might be considered unusual and therefore bad.
Traditionally, I think sex was viewed as something that a wife had a duty to offer, and a man had a right to take. This gives rise to an attitude that the sexual activities of men should not be questioned, that men are not really responsible for their urges or their behaviour. So when a man sexually assaults a woman, the first response is to blame the victim, to look for some way in which she might have caused it.
We have similar problems in Western countries. However I think we are a little further advanced in dealing with them.
I’ve been following this discussion silently for a while and as far as I can understand it there are two camps:
1) the Western Guys who have seen their sex life with their Japanese wives disappear despite a healthy start and are confused as to why, and
2) the people who claim that the sole reason is that those guys are selfish in bed and just use their wife as a masturbation tool and hence there is no wonder that their wives aren’t interested.
Well I’m in the first camp but would like to redirect the discussion here a little as I feel it is getting a little off topic. I had a wonderful sex life with my wife (then girl-friend) for many years. She enjoyed it and often even instigated it herself. Over the years I have spent more and more time trying to understand her needs and make sure that she is the focus of “the event”. If anything now, I’m “better” now than I was when our sex life was at it’s peak. As far as I can read the thread here it seems to me as though there are a lot of guys like this and that is why they are confused. It would make more sense if it was something that never existed but it is something that has disappeared despite a lot of effort. For this reason I don’t really think the advice submitted by those writers in group 2 really helps. Am I right?
Kanbatsu, there are more than 2 groups here. I think that you guys who are having problems, probably should have marriage counselling before you get married, if you didn’t before you got married, then you should do it now, regardless of how far along in your marriage you are. The reason why, is that then you both will know that you’re on the same page regarding this issue. Of course, people aren’t mind-readers, and i say this because i have been through this kind of thing with my Japanese husband, where he expects a certain thing and i don’t know it because i can’t read his mind.
It takes alot of communication and understanding for a relationship, whether married, or not, to work. The biggest point to me is communication! Talk about what you both want, exchange your ideas, and let someone help you along, guide you. A marriage counsellor, or even a counsellor is a great way to do this as the woman in your life feels safe that she will not be backed into a corner, there is someone there to mediate.
I can say, that you know at first a relationship is shiny and new and you want to do it every day, but as life gets along sometimes women don’t want to do it. Sometimes it’s not just about not wanting to do it, women have very different emotions to men and sometimes we have hormonal imbalances and problems such as those. It can’t all be blamed on culture and society, there are other underlying issues.
For example, when i got married to my husband yes we were like rabbits. But then i started taking hormones to get pregnant and my emotional state was all over the place, not to mention the hormones made me feel nothing, i couldn’t get aroused, i couldn’t orgasm, it was terrible. The best thing was that my husband, although he was frustrated, stuck with me, understood that it wasn’t my fault, it was the drugs i was taking, and through his love and encouragement we found a way. At one point i was so over sex, i didn’t want to do it all, it actually hurt me to have sex, but because of his love and commitment to me, we are still married 5 years later, because he took the time to understand me, we both communicated about it to each other, what we were feeling etc. I was pretty embarrassed but if you share the problem it is lesser.
I think the key word is communication. I don’t think anyone’s opinion on here is of lesser value, the point is it’s a discussion and we all come from different backgrounds, but it’s interesting to see the different points of view. Kanbatsu i wish you luck with your relationship. I can’t help feeling though that you lift up the words “the event”, maybe that is why your wife is backing off? If you played it down a little bit, she might feel more at ease. Cheers
(i can only say that is coming from a woman’s point of view)
kanbatsu
for the sake of discussion it may be possible that two categories of postings exist. though based on what has been written on this thread they aren’t significant numbers in group two.
perhaps considerably less that 50%, again based on the postings. if i’m in error, then please point out such.
as you state you are in group two and you have gotten ‘better’(i’m not sure that the women in most men’s lives can say that) then i am certainly puzzled as to why your sex life is less than you wish it too be. while nothing is ever 100% your dissatisfaction must be low enough for you to post here.
my first question is how has your lifestyle changed? therein may lie an answer
Well the main change for me has been my heightened focus on what my wife wants or might want. I’ve read lots of books and try to spend as much time as I can getting her relaxed and helping her enjoy both ordinary life and that after dark.
I’m not sure where you have studied, Mitaboy, but as far as I can tell everything you have written on this page is verbatim out of “Mars and Venus in the Bedroom: A Guide to Lasting Romance and Passion” by John Gray. Now there’s nothing wrong with that. I enjoyed the read despite the crass title. Infact, Nagoyan, you might find it interesting even though I think it is more written for the benefit of men.
So for that perspective, Mitaboy, can I ask you directly? What do I do if she wont let me help her to enjoy sex more. By that, specifically, I mean that she just doesn’t want me to touch her “downstairs” at all (hand, mouth, you name it). How can I help her to feel good if for her it is some sort of taboo. Have you run across a woman like that before?
kanbatsu
[If anything now, I’m “better” now than I was when our sex life was at it’s peak.]
before i can attempt to answer your question, what has she said or done to convince you that you are better?
have you ever touched her “downstairs”? reaction?
i need to try to understand her.
as i’ve never had your experience
Yes, I have. And she told me to stop as she was too embarassed. “hazukashii”
kanbatsu
(copied from post 251)
[If anything now, I’m “better” now than I was when our sex life was at it’s peak.]
before i can attempt to answer your question,
what has she said
or
done to convince you that you are “better”?
I have been reading the article and comments with great interest. Having been in Japan for many times and being married to a Japanese woman for two years now, I think I have some ideas on the issue. I think first of all that things should not be seen too specifically as a problem for Japanese women and men, and their foreign partners, as these matters are a problem all over the world. This regarding of the Japanese as a ’special’ case is something they cultivate not in the least by themselves (being Japanese is completely different from any other race…blabla…)
Anyhow, something that plays surely an important role is the way Japanese women view their own sexuality and role. First of all Japanese woman are taught from a very early age that being passive is being attractive. When one looks at Japanese porn, the girls are always being DONE things to. They cry, whine, plead, say no please, don’t hurt me, forgive me etc. (mou yurushite, yamete yamete, yada, hazukashi, itai….). Compare this porn with the US stuff where women scream YES,YES, harder etc. Their school uniforms make them also unable to express any sexuality or uniqueness. Some ‘bad’ ones may secretly roll up their skirt after school so that it becomes much shorter, but it doesn’t get them anywhere. On the other hand I experienced also a less self-conscious and less guilty attitude towards sex, probably due to the lack of christian morale.
Wishing everyone on the forum a very good day,
Kuroobi
fuckedgaijin
I think japanese women are the most desired because of the lack of understanding of their culture. I think a outside in view is that they are humble, submissive, and most of all loyal and all they want in return is a loving provider. But that’s not how it goes in reality they aren’t like that at all, except the provider part but what woman doesn’t want that. In reality once they have a provider that’s the main thing, and then they naturally shift over to family caretaker money management once kids arrive and everything else including you is a distant second. I have to strongly disagree that japanese women are the most beautiful, I realized that it’s all the things that you think they are that they aren’t that makes them more desired, at least for me. My infatuation for the japanese woman evaporated into a more cynical disillusion, the more I researched the culture and got to know some. I think it’s that common infatuation with the image of a japanese woman that makes her attractive vs the actual woman and makes you look past her looks. This doesn’t mean that they aren’t attractive but more a overall sense of cuteness, but the cute mannerisms, laughs and antics all get ruined when viewed with the entire arrogance and in some aspects undeveloped nature of communication.(no, I am not misunderstanding it you should be able to communicate in any and all forms to have a deeper understanding of communication) When I look at a pretty japanese woman I think “ahh she’s cute” when I see a pretty brazilian, african, spanish african american, italian and yadda yadda woman I get ‘Like a rock’ and that speaks volumes to me.
You go out and find a Japanese woman and think you have the best woman in the world because you don’t fully understand her or the culture and feel in time things will grow and you look back sometime later realizing that the woman you have while you might love her is not the same woman. You basically got trapped pretty much all women in every culture do this, don’t feel bitter about it just figure out how you want to move forward. Anyway I would never marry a japanese woman now, I would date them but I can’t see myself marrying one. To all who have congratulations I wish nothing but happiness for you
It sounds like you are angry towards Japanese women, perhaps because of your own experience. I’m entering my 9th year of marriage to a Japanese girl now. I’ve read all the posts as they come in from this thread and its been interesting getting everyones different experiences and views. Our sex life has definitely declined with time and after kids it also took a dive. Looking back I thought she’d changed from the girl I met as lots of other guys think. But I’ve changed to. I also thought she was distant at times and cold. But now I slowing a bit, and I kinda get it I think. Relationships are such a complex thing and theres alot of give and take required. Forgiveness. I learnt to be patient after having kids. I guess kids grounded me allot and maybe girls get grounded a lot fasted than us guys. I think it doesn’t matter what nationality of girl you marry, sex will always change and maybe its just a case that it changes at different rates for the sexes. As I get older sex doesn’t hold center stage. 9 years and Im still learning about her, I’ll probably fully understand her just before I die if ever but its one of her charms. Shes still mysterious, but learning all these things has been a great journey. Dont get me wrong, we have had shit times, she went back to Japan once or twice with the kids to have a break, but we stuck at it. I will stick with it because I think my family deserves it. Thats what makes strength. Takes a long time to get to know some one who’s not your family, no matter where they come from.
The Japanese are not special or different they are just people like you and me. To them we are weird. I think maybe you should take a good hard look at yourself before putting a stamp on the women of a particular culture.
Here Here Mr V! Well said!
It has been interesting to read the view and comments of so many people. I am married to a Japanese lady and we are expecting a baby later this year. From our discussions, I can now understand how this becomes such a big impediment to sex in Japan.
Unlike in Australia or the US where they say there is no problem making love (other than there is a good chance she might not feel up to it), in Japan the doctors actively recommend against making love while the wife is pregnant. Additionally, after the baby is born it is common to for the baby to sleep in the same bed as the parents, in between them. These issues have the potential to take this intimacy out of the marriage for a long time during which a routine is created.
Obviously these are just 2 of many different issues that could cause problems but ones I have noticed that don’t seem to be discussed too much above.
To Majimeaussie,
Gidday Im a kiwi, just over the ditch. And after 2 kids I definitely recommend putting baby in a separate room from day 1 if you have the space. It will save untold problems later. But it might take some smooth talking on your part if your wife has other ideas. Do some research on it. As long as you have a fast response time to babys needs, baby will be content and feel safe and being in the room next door is no issue really. We did it with both our kids and its smooth sailing now. The first baby is always a steep learning curve but just relax with them really and enjoy! congrats by the way
Unless you have a space issue there is no reason why you can’t have the baby in your room. Just get a cot with wheels on it. I find that is a good way to go as you can wheel baby in and out of the room, when you need to. Keep the baby in the room as long as you feel or mother feels the need to keep an eye on the baby, and for other times wheel it out into the baby’s room.
I wouldn’t advocate having the baby actively sleeping in the bed with parents as there is a chance of rolling on the baby, or SIDS. Plus it’s just going to mess up their head at a later date, and it will be harder to get them to sleep in their own bed. It’s better to set a routine now, before they get older and too reliant on sleeping in your bed.
Doctors in any country say alot of BS about what you can and can’t do while pregnant, it’s up to the mother and how she feels her limits are.
I think Mr V is right though, there are alot of guys on here that think they’re pretty special coz they married a japanese woman and now having probs in their sex life. It’s not just with japanese women it’s with any race of women. Every marriage is hard work and it takes a lot of understanding and committment to make it right. No one said it was a walk in the park.
The underlying issue is that women are far more complex than men can ever understand. We have emotions you men don’t have. I would recommend getting out a Dr Phil book from the library, it worked for my marriage. Japanese men are hard to understand too you know! But somehow with a bit of reading, alot of understanding and compassion, it happened. You have to understand that us not wanting to have sex is mostly not a reflection on you guys, get over yourselves! We have emotions far beyond what you can comprehend, why do we have to explain it? I think pre-marriage counselling is good. Then you can set out your demands and things you want, before you tie the knot. If you’re not happy with her, you can go your separate ways and find a nymphomaniac who suits your needs.
Kelly
I think it’s certainly true that there can be many reasons for sexual problems in a relationship. And many of those reasons are universal. But most of the problems discussed in this thread have nothing to do with baby sleeping arrangements and other easily remedied concerns, they are about a clash of values stemming from cultural differences. Some people don’t seem to believe that such differences actually exist, or are worthy of consideration. I think it’s commendable to keep an open mind and steer clear of stereotypes and cliches. It’s important not to overlook the obvious and invent imaginary causes for simple problems. But at the end of the day these things called Japanese culture and Western culture are real, and learning about how they interact is valuable to those of us trying to bridge the gap.
I don’t think that women are any more or less complicated than men, and I think that such beliefs are chauvinistic. There are vast differences in how men and women relate to their own emotions, but that’s another story.
You have totally missed the point of what those people were saying then.
And also if you refuse to believe that women have a depth of emotions that you can’t relate to, then relationships will always be a problem for you.
And also, i wasn’t stating that it wasn’t a clash of cultures. Of course it is one, but at the most basic level it’s a relationship between Man and Woman. Of course the cultural consideration is worthy, but it’s not the be all and end all of a relationship. You talk about stereotypes but you are the one who is analysing the relationship on race only.
“It’s important not to overlook the obvious and invent imaginary causes for simple problems”
What imaginary causes are you referring to, James?
I don’t believe that men lack emotional depth. What possible basis can there be for a comparison between the emotions of two different people? It’s the height of presumption to claim to know what another person is feeling. You’ve compared what you feel with what you imagine I feel, and you expect me to believe you when you tell me that you have “emotional depth” and I don’t. If I tried to convince you that I had discovered that I possessed some intangible quality that you lacked, would you pay any attention to me? I don’t think so.
It’s simply not true that I only analyse relationships in terms of cultural factors. But I would say that I think that where men have complained about passivity and lack of interest in sex from their partners, it is mostly caused by Japanese attitudes to sex. The statistics discussd in the article bear this out in my opinion.
Also I think that knowlege of real Japanese culture is lacking in most of us Westerners, and therefore culture is the most beneficial topic of conversation.
I didn’t say that women have more emotions than men what i wanted to say is that women have emotions that men can never understand and it is the same for men. Unless we can each live as a woman and a man we will never truly understand what each other is thinking or feeling.
I am not trying to convince you of anything, this is just a discussion. You can believe what you want as i am free to do so.
I would never try to think i know what my husband is thinking or feeling because i don’t. Yes he’s from a totally different culture than me. It can’t be all about his race though. It’s about if he’s willing to sit down and communicate with me what exactly he wants in our relationship and if i do the same. Yeah, some Japanese are brought up in the way that their parents never expressed love for each other, never talked about relationships. He is from such a family, but somehow he knew what he wanted, and he tried to move out of that shell that he grew up in and sought to express himself where his family could not teach him how to.
How many times have i looked at him and had no idea what he was thinking! So many! But if i do not ask him and he does not tell me…then this is what i think these guys are facing. It’s lack of communication. Even if we have cultural differences, there are ways around it.
We tend to treat each other as mind readers in relationships but the truth is we don’t know if you don’t tell and vice versa. You won’t know unless you ask.
Also, if you find that you are getting into a serious relationship with a japanese guy or girl, and sex is important to you, i think you should have a serious in depth communication about your expectations. It’s common sense don’t you think?
I feel that people on here are blaming the fact of cultural differences, but just like any other relationship, if you didn’t sit down and voice what you want, he or she will not know it and keep going on blindly, oblivious to your wants or needs.
I have been married for 5 years and i didn’t get here because i scrutinised his culture. I got here by understanding and communicating with my husband.
I agree with what you say about communication. But I think that when you are dealing with someone from another culture you often don’t know what are the important questions to ask. People frequently don’t really know why they do things or see things a certain way. Our fundamental values and expectations are formed at a very young age, so we are not very aware of them, which makes it hard to talk about them. So I think learning a bit about the culture can make communication easier.
Hi I am Gaijin(asian) married to a wondeful Japanese man.I fell inlove with him because of his wonderful qualities.He is very exceptional among the Japanese,He is affectionate,thoughtful,open of his feelings and emotions.We tell each other we love each other everyday.Englis is our main communication since we are both speaking different language,He speaks excellent english(he had his masters degree and phd in UCLA).The marriage was beautiful until after 3 years i slowly changes (We are married for almost 7 years now).As what youve said,sex declined which I dont really mind I am busy with the kids and house too.But from once in two weeks in becomes once a month and sometimes onece in two months,We kissd,we hugs and thats about it,Sometimes I would innitiate and joke to him once the kids are asleep but he would say he would finish answering all his emails first then he would come very late sometimes like 3 oclock in the morning,which I am already deadly tired and soun asleep by that time.Ive tried a lot of things dress nicely,wear sexy lingerie,he loves my body but its just what it is.And life is becoming more and more monotonous,I take care of the kids the house,his needs( I dont take care of his money) he gives me a lil allowance(which I am contented),I go for grocery,brings the kids to their activities,do their homeworks and dad is at home we play,we eat outside.Its a picture of a happy family which is what I want(love my kids soooo much) and also what he wants.Its like that all the time,My life revolves in this home sweet home with emptiness,I wasnt looking for anything other than the way things used to be(good laugh,good communication,and affection).My husband use to be saying Im his besfriend and I felt teh same way but not anymore.I felt like we are drifting apart.
I sometimes do soul searching,and sometimes wonders,If we will continue to be like these for years,by the time I will have the guts to get out I would be old and wouldnt be able to enjoy life to much at all,I have tallked abot it to my husband but still the same.Im just 25 now and living in misery and suffering in silence,Good thing I have my kids theyre the reasons wake up everymorning…
To Mr. V in post 256
While I congratulate you on your 9th year of marriage, I have to say your comment of “anger towards japanese women” comment is s far off base I assume it’s because your overly sensitive to my criticism your married to one. I’m sure my snapshot post can be of my views and experiences weren’t complete and therefore possibly misleading, however a quick review of your own statement is in order;
“I also thought she was distant at times and cold. But now I slowing a bit, and I kinda get it I think.” ” I think it doesn’t matter what nationality of girl you marry, sex will always change and maybe its just a case that it changes at different rates for the sexes.”
This clearly shows me that on some level your changing to meet her expectations vs marriage which what I have been taught is about growing together each and every day. Now this happens in a number of ways but one of which that’s very important is compromise, where is the compromise ? I’m not referring to you specifically at this point but the question in general when view with most of the posts here along side the comments I quoted above. You can’t have compromise without communication, and in my experience along side some comments made that seems to be where the big gap is. See when all I knew about Japan and it’s people was what’s filtered through in america and samurai sunday for those old enough to remember, I had this view of a whole culture of honest honorable people, I fell victim to a stereotype. My experiences led me to the conclusion that the present day Japanese woman is much different then the ones from the older generation, much like the USA. So with my eyes wide open I took another look and discovered they aren’t exactly what I would look for in a mate. Though I’m sure it’s not impossible to find one. I find myself MORE attracted to woman of other cultures with PASSION and who aren’t afraid to communicate and grow with over time, and I simply thrive on that. I like Japan, the culture and it’s people…… it’s just I like other things more, is that so bad ?
PS Forgot to say it’s not all about sex, at least not with me. Some posts here talk about the absence of affection as well that to me is more critical then the act of sex itself. I’m very understanding of a woman not being in the mood, heck I’ve even been the one with the “head ache” (it was a very weird and strange time I don’t wanna talk to much about it) however Affection is a must! That’s one of the core needs of a marriage, and with my experiences along side the comments on this page one of my biggest criticism of being with a japanese woman. Me disagreeing with the most beautiful women in the world comment is just my opinion and I think I have a point, I was one of them. Most people who grow fascinated with them have been influenced by media at some point first, those who have traveled there and gotten enchanted while there, well that’s more genuine and not what I am discussing.
To James of post 261 and 263
I agree and whole heartily support with your comments and views, and not just because they line up with my own. It is because of similarities that I am able to understand your view. I don’t even understand Mr V’s post in response to mine in 256 when I reread it, seem he miss the point of my post completely nothing in his post is replying to the points made in mine though for some reason I thought their was a word limit and cut bits out which made it less clear, I do admit that.
To kelly
Understanding comes with patience, time and communication to say women can’t be understood is in my mind insane, it’s all about how vulnerable you can allow yourself to be to get that person to open up to you and expose themselves, some make this harder then it should be. But I say to you NO woman or man WILLING to communicate will remain misunderstood(though they might be crazy *shrug*) it’s simply impossible unless you have a really hard time listening… a really really hard time. Their isn’t a voodoo about it or something mysterious, women aren’t from venus they just dress like it(comments made in () are not meant to offend but lighten the mood
)
I can understand emotions I’ve be looking listening and watching for long time, but it’s why that gets me and most time when I try to get deeper into it they can’t even explain the why to me. So I think it’s more about women coming to terms with their emotions/feelings so they can explain themselves and dare say they at times may not even know themselves. Men on the other hand know exactly how they feel but because of how we are brought up(mostly older gen.) we have a hard time talking about it because of the manhood thing so we bottle it up and don’t deal with it. Some of that still filters down, some men raise sons differently to include the things they wish they had from their fathers and to talk about how they feel more and that it isn’t a bad thing. I think in america this isn’t recognized and when it was, the media dubbed “metro male” and lumped the “metro male” with the “talking man” and made it viewed as a bad thing again. I’m am interested in how japanese men are raised to evaluate the cultural differences that may exist.
Mr LOVALOVA totally missed my point. When i said that you would never relate to women i was talking about a depth of emotions. I’m not making it hard for anyone, i just see that certain things that women deal with in life, men will never experience, and therefore never truly understand. It is the same for men, we women will never understand what it is like to be a man, unless we have a sex change, so therefore, understanding the way men think is not going to happen. Sure, as i have lived with my husband for just under 6 years, i can understand what my husband is thinking, just through knowing my husband, the way he acts, what he likes, i will know to a certain extent how i think he is going to think about something or react. But that is only through repetition, not because i understand exactly what he is thinking. He is the same with me.
YUBI, have you actually talked to your husband about this? Maybe he is doing it without realising, maybe he is tired. I have experienced that with my husband before, but i talked to him about it and he had no idea, just because he was busy at work and had a lot of things to do, he was very tired and wanted some time on his own, but he didn’t know what my feelings were and didn’t know i was hurt. I think you should sit down with him casually, with a cup of tea or something and slowly bring up the subject, talk to him about it, tell him how you feel. Don’t accuse, but just talk about your feelings. See what he has to say. If you want to talk about it email me at bananamanju(@)hotmail.com
Mr V,
Thanks for the congratulations and I understand what you are saying. We are discussing the issue and I am sure that we will come to an agreeable solution.
Kelly,
While I appreciate your comments and understand where you are coming from, it seems to me that they are lacking a bit of a cultural awareness. For your comment “I wouldn’t advocate having the baby actively sleeping in the bed with parents … Plus it’s just going to mess up their head at a later date” you do realize that the baby sleeping with the parents is very common in Japan don’t you. From talking to various Japanese people probably more than 50% and sometimes up to Junior highschool age. Have that many Japanese really got messed up heads?
Also your comment “Doctors in any country say alot of BS about what you can and can’t do while pregnant, it’s up to the mother and how she feels her limits are.” also seems to lack cultural awareness. You realize that Japanese are brought up to trust and not question doctors. With that and the nervousness of a first pregnancy you expect a Japanese wife to just blow off the doctors instructions? Once again, from the way I have been brought up I can understand your comments and agree to them to a large extent but in the Japanese context they are not going to work.
On the discussion of cultural v personal issues in the marriage. In our case I think we look at each other as husband and wife first and foremost. Not foreign husband / Japanese wife. There are some issues that are due to personal items and some that are definitely related to cultural issues. To deal with the issues related to culture it is necessary to recognize this and discuss a solution reasonable to both of us.
I have been reading and watching these comments with interest. My wife has been discussing alot with you. Actually, i agree with her posts because i believe in “when in rome do as romans do”. If we are here in australia, as Japanese, we should follow the custom. So, my wife is right.
I think my wife has culture awareness, in fact, more than me, even i grew up in Japan. I think alot of Japanese are messed up, and i don’t think Japanese have great culture, in my opinion, it’s kind of fucked. I always say this. I just don’t agree with alot of things my people do.
When my wife and i went to Japan, my wife followed all culture so well, i was so proud of her, because she had attend university for 3 years, she knew more about polite culture than me. Even i’m Japanese, my family is not so traditional, so she taught me few things. And my parents love her because she speak Japanese with them well, and fit into my family so well.
I think if my wife had our kids in Japan she would follow the custom as far as she could, but it is ok to make your own new way. As husband and wife we have made our own new way of relationship, we don’t have to follow others.
Well that is just i wanted to say. That i don’t want kids sleeping in same bed with me anyway. I want kids having their own beds. My bed is for me and my wife.
to kelly
I have not missed your point I disagree with your point for the reasons I outline in my post.
I said;
“Understanding comes with patience, time and communication”
you said in your response;
“When i said that you would never relate to women i was talking about a depth of emotions.”
I strongly disagree, you then said
” i just see that certain things that women deal with in life, men will never experience, and therefore never truly understand. ”
With the exception of things physical, I see little to support this statement and it’s not that I am undermining that difference I just fail to see how it vastly separates us emotionally. Not to say I haven’t given it sufficient thought. Please feel free to highlight these differences if you will.
You then go on and say;
“Sure, as i have lived with my husband for just under 6 years, i can understand what my husband is thinking, just through knowing my husband, the way he acts, what he likes, i will know to a certain extent how i think he is going to think about something or react. But that is only through repetition, not because i understand exactly what he is thinking. He is the same with me.”
To start that opening statement sounds a lot like the result of “Understanding comes with patience, time and communication” knowing a person’s likes and dislikes is not what I am talking about, it’s deeper then that. Remember “it’s all about how vulnerable you can allow yourself to be to get that person to open up to you and expose themselves” We are talking about a relationship/marriage so this statement applies to both the man and the woman. No ones a mind reader if your inner deepest thought are locked away for fear no one will understand, the person might have the wrong reaction, you want them to understand without sying it or whatever other reasons exist you then no one possibly will understand you. It’s up to you and your spouse/companion to open proper lines of communication and talk about those feeling. And you should be able to make each other feel comfortable enough to do so.
My question to you, Are you saying woman have deep emotions once communicated, can’t be understood by men ?
“With the exception of things physical, I see little to support this statement”
I was stating my OPINION, i don’t have to give you evidence of it. You are not here for a conversation, only to steamroll my opinion.
In my relationship it’s not about vulnerability. My husband has seen that side of me, knows that side of me. We just have grown up in such different worlds, it will be years and years before we know each other to that depth. It’s not about letting someone get close to us, it’s about finding out about each other as the years go on. Neither of us is trying to make it hard for the other one, or trying to close ourselves off from each other.
“To start that opening statement sounds a lot like the result of “Understanding comes with patience, time and communication” knowing a person’s likes and dislikes is not what I am talking about, it’s deeper then that.”
Well that is my marriage you are talking about. And it works for us. And it’s deep enough for us.
“No ones a mind reader if your inner deepest thought are locked away for fear no one will understand, the person might have the wrong reaction, you want them to understand without sying it or whatever other reasons exist you then no one possibly will understand you. It’s up to you and your spouse/companion to open proper lines of communication and talk about those feeling. And you should be able to make each other feel comfortable enough to do so. ”
My deepest thoughts are not locked away. You see before i got married, i failed to tell my husband one very important thing that had happened to me, and scarred me for life. It affected our sexual relationship very bad, until i opened up to him and told him about it. My secret was revealed, the thing which i had told no one. My husband did not run away from me, he stayed with me, supported me and helped me through it. Every day is a challenge, but he is always there for me, supporting me. He made me realise it wasn’t my fault. I was the victim. My deepest thoughts my husband knows, my deepest fears, my husband already knows. We’ve already opened our lines to communication and we talk about our feelings.
However, the little things, the cultural ideas will always be different, sometimes known, sometimes unknown, in our relationship. I’m still learning about him every day, and i think i will keep learning new things about him every day until i die. And he will about me too, until the day he dies.
im married to a japanese man. we live with his entire family including grandparents, parents, siblings, etc… we are never alone together, we dont sleep in the same room and none of the doors (screens) in his house have locks (including the bathroom). before we were married we met and lived together in ny. it was a different story then. after i moved to japan with him i feel like i married a stranger. and i lost my entire life.
Hey Lost,
If you need to talk azumarisan(@)gmail.com email me.
I’m just wondering why you are all together in one house? Seems abit crowded, especially because i know how small Japanese houses are. Is there a reason for it? Did you agree to it?
Kelly
Hi Lost,
I’m sorry to hear things are so difficult for you. However, I wonder if your husband is any happier about the situation than you are. The Japanese prefer to suffer alone, so if he is miserable he may not discuss it with you.
It’s also possible that he sees the situation quite differently to you. He may see some positives to the situation that you don’t. Maybe he saw this situation coming for a long time and has prepared himself for it, but neglected to tell you (the Japanese are terrible at discussing expectations). If you could get him to talk about the situation, I’m sure you would learn some things that would surprise you, and hopefully help you find a way to improve your domestic situation.
- James
*Phew* I just finished reading everything. It had me hooked!
I’m a student of Japanese at University in my final year now having been in a couple of relationships with Japanese girls myself. As I’m far from knowledgeable about most of the finer points about frequency of sex and especially marriage, I’ll refrain from comment right now.
But one thing that did occur to me reading through this thread was the tendency to advocate communication as a means of resolving relationship issues. I, having been raised in Britain, also believe communication is crucial to the healthy functioning of a relationship, for resolving sexual differences and conveying feelings (although I realise that this is a very general statement to make). However, I have heard in the past and run into problems myself in the relationships I had that, as a generalisation, Japanese people tend not to be as direct and expressive as most Westerners. This point has also been iterated in this very thread.
Given then, that some Japanese people don’t feel comfortable, natural or immediately at ease with this Western-style of directing conveying one’s feelings, what is to say that direct and open communication is the best way to overcome the cultural differences that arise in international relationships? If Japanese people do not feel comfortable discussing their feelings and a certain amount of ishin-denshin (unspoken understanding) is expected by them, how might a Westerner better shift his or her focus to the Japanese way of ‘thinking’ – that is, the more indirect, passive method of understanding?
Is this even possible for a Westerner with only a moderate amount of understanding of Japanese society or is it absolutely necessary for Japanese people to ‘break out’ of their shell and learn to directly convey their feelings? In other words, can these sexual problems be alleviated without the need to resort to face-to-face conversations about them which many Japanese may find hard?
Well i have lived overseas and i feel that going back to japan i could not have relationship with japanese women because they play games. Of course they dont tell me what they really feel cuz its some big game to them. I like western women cuz they say what they mean and what they want. The time wasted playing games is too much. Cuz from my prespective ive dated japanese womenw hen i was home and it wasnt that good.
I think my people should open up and say what they mean its the time to do that. Wake up japan! i say. I guess though that japanese who dont go outside of japan will never wake up cuz they have such narrow view of the world they cant express themselves and who they are. I kinda look down on them cuz i feel sorry for them but i cant take that narrow minded view.
I’m happy to have r/ship with women outside of japan and i like to think i’m a little diff to the average japanese maybe it’s proud. But anyway i think if you try to figure out japanese women too much it will just do your head in, cuz they like playing games thats it.
I agree you have to communicate to work a relationship out and japanese are famous for not communiating and not having relationships work cuz of it. Anyway marriage in japan is not for love its cuz it’s expected. We got told long ago we dont have to love the person just marry them have kids do the expected way. I cant stand that way. I want to be with my love.
The last bullet point in the article (paraphrased, that some couples develop a brother-sister relationship that makes sex feel repulsive) had me shaking my head. My wife is Japanese, I’m American, and I’ve lost all interest in sex with her because I feel like she’s either a younger sister or a daughter (which frankly is how she behaves – not like a grown-up woman) so the idea of sex with her at this point is a real turn-off. She doesn’t feel that way but she also doesn’t do a good job at pretending she’s attracted to me. I think she just wants us to remember how to have sex so we remember how to do it when we want to have kids.
An interesting point Bill. I have a friend who is married to a Japanese woman in a similar situation. He describes their relationship as more like brother and sister and says all sexual flair has been lost. Their are many other possible contributing factors in their relationship from what I gather though, but it is saddening to hear what they are going through. I hope you can revive the passion in your relationship. Mitaboy claims to be knowledgeable on the subject – maybe you should contact him..?
When it comes to the issue of communication, I think both partners have to compromise a bit. It’s not possible for a westerner to adopt the Japanese way of relating in less than a couple of years, so the Japanese partner has to accept this. And the Western/other nationality partner has to understand that communicating openly goes against years of conditioning and is not going to be easy for a Japanese person. So you have to find a middle ground.
I agree with Komorisan, that Japanese people don’t communicate and that this ruins relationships. But what I have come to appreciate is how much you can communicate effectively without words, show them that you care rather than tell them. Which I think may be a more Japanese way of having a relationship.
Sexuality is not regarded as a positive thing in Japan. They are like 18th century Europe: sex is dirty, doing it makes you dirty, chastity is a virtue. Probably the reason for this is the propagation of pornography, because sex is not depicted at all in mainstream media. So people don’t get exposed to a lot of positive role models. Given how vile Japanese porn generally is it’s no wonder girls aren’t that interested in sex.
- James
james largely hit the nail on the head.
japanese women have a mixed hollywood tainted, sex and the city, knight in shining armor, white picket fence view of marriage and sex.
the communication starts before marriage. girls ask me what’s wrong if we aren’t having sex.
after marriage communication regarding sexual issues certainly is more difficult(if not impossible?)
what many western men fail to realize is that sex is more of a performance for japanese women. they DO NOT enjoy it nor need it at the same level as western women.
my email is available to anyone through the administrator
Interesting thoughts Mitaboy. May I ask you something? From what I gather from this thread, you are not yet married, but you say you have had lots of success pleasing women and make your expectations from the relatinship clear from the start.
If communicating about sexual issues is a lot more difficult or even impossible after marriage, how do you plan to avoid the common senario of sex going out the window after marriage? I know you said you would get divorced if your future wife stopped having sex with you on the level you want, but I’m supposing you would try to fix the problem first..?
Also, James, some interesting stuff. Just how far do you think it is possible for a Westerner/person of another nationality to adopt the ‘Japanese’ way of communiating? And if it is possible, how much do you think constitutes a healthy marriage in terms of open communication? As in, just how much open communication is necessary to avoid stagnation in a relationship? Difficult questions, I know, but I’d like to hear what you think.
tremor
have yet to have sexual issues because i’m really direct about my sexual desires very early in the relationship. in most cases BEFORE we’ve had sex the first time, and certainly by the third sexual encounter. feel free to modify the following as you deem fit.
please do not ask why it works. i charge for that information.
the wording is very specific. change at your own risk.
[many japanese girls are fun to be with, like new experiences, almost willing to try anything. many american girls are not so open-minded.
but many or most Japanese girls are not that good at sex, some are just horrible.probably most japanese women are not good at sex because many japanese men are soooooo bad. but i still have to be careful about that. especially because i’m not a selfish person. japan’s population is shrinking because people are not enjoying sex, sex make babies, very simple logic.
american men are used to sex 3 – 5 times a week. japanese girls 1 – 2 times - maybe. for many american women, if the sex is not good women will leave their men.]
the bar has been set. those that are not interested are instantly weeded out. i suspect, but i don’t know because i’m not married that as the bar has been set the japanese woman isn’t likely to change. if she did for other than health reasons i would leave, period. i stae as much in my relationships and have done so on one occasion. as i’ve stated earlier they ask me when the sexual frequency goes down. then again i spend considerable pleasing them, it is almost like a drug.
the pleasure part. sorry, i charge for that information too, but the information is free on the internet. the “why?”of the above text isn’t available on the internet. i use the “why it works?” in various aspects of a relationship and it does work.
i counsel on this all the time. western men make mistakes BEFORE they get into the relationships with japanese women. the mistakes generally occur because japanese women satisfy needs and desires that many western(american) men had not had success in having fulfilled in america. japanese women can do so at a minimal level because many of the men had sub-par to very few relationships in america. please note i’m using many men, not most men, though from empirical observations i can think i can say most. my expectations of women were forged in america. i just altered my approach to account for cultural perceptions when i came to japan.
forgive the mistakes (:_;)
I think that communication in any culture is largely a matter of symbols, little cliches that convey a lot of information. And you can pick these up simply by involving yourself in the culture, by reading books and watching movies. It’s hard and it’s a slow business, but it can be done. I like reading books and watching movies so I don’t see it as a chore. I can’t say I’ve achieved a great level of success, but on the other hand I’ve come a long way. And the more effort you make at communicating with your partner, the more you build up a level of shared understanding that is quite independant of cultural differences.
I doubt many Japanese are very good at explaining things like this, but if you learn to ask the right questions, you can get a lot out of talking to people too.
It’s a very good question as to how much open communication is necessary. I guess it depends on you, really. What do you want out of your relationship and how much can you compromise before the relationship stops being viable. The more secure you feel in the relationship, the less communication you need. I think there is a natural sort of entropy that causes people to drift apart, so the minimum is what is necessary to counteract this.
- James
Thanks for the replies.
Mitaboy>> Interesting theories. I hope you are right about the bar having been set before a relationship. I have always been pretty open about what I want and tried to satisfy my girlfriend’s needs too, but it’s difficult to know if I’m getting everything right. I think that, as other people have also noted, perhaps the frequency of sex declines naturally as we get older, regardless of culture. Of course, this will vary between people too, so I think (and hope) it’s a matter of good communication about one another’s needs very early on. You mention ‘before’ the relationship. I have never been as forward as to tell someone I’m interested in just how much sex I would like before, but I make it pretty clear soon afterwards my needs. I wonder, do you think notion of telling it before the ‘kokuhaku’ begins is gravely important, or is it more important just to be clear early on?
James>> Good points. It puzzles and perplexes me how situations where couples have these problems arise though. I’m somewhat idealistic I realise, but wouldn’t open communication throughout the relationship solve these sorts of problems? I realise there are probably things after marriage that occur that one cannot forsee, but surely issues of sex and the frequency of it, expectations and possible problems like sex and pregnancy will (and arguably should) be discussed long before marriage even occurs..?
tremor: I wonder, do you think notion of telling it before the ‘kokuhaku’ begins is gravely important, or is it more important just to be clear early on?
gravely – not so ominous but very important. my opinion, early on is too late unless you can handle her unwillingness or perhaps leaving the situation totally. i’m 52, while i do realize age is a factor in sexual frequency my expectation is 3 – 5 times a week and i try to date those women that are physically capable. that is to say 25 to 25 year old women.
That is very intersting article and makes me think about the turning point that we Japanese guys have to alter attitude toward women.
I am Japanese guy; however, I have been spending most of the time in the States lately and am pretty sure that I am totally different from typical Japanese men…am lot Americanized.
When I went back to Japan for the first time in three years, it was very weird to me that men expected women to obey them. In my office, a few men treated women like things. Probably, they could be only satisfied with taking over women, and that gives them a kind of dignity and confidence as a man. Of course, every Japanese guy is NOT like them, and some Non-Japanese guys also treat women like a pig.
I do not mean either the way Japanese guys behave toward women or the way American do is good or bad because of cultural differences. However, Who in the world expect women to be his kind of slave? Lol We are in 2008.
As the time goes by, things have to be changed.
Btw,I’d like you to read the book “Tuesdays with Morrie” and “Who moved my cheese”
I bet it WILL change your life.
Take care you guys!
Kelly-
I stop responding because talking to you is pointless, I’m talking about relationships not your marriage. We may cover some of that in our conversation but remember what the overall topic/subtopic is, this isn’t or rather should not have been personal. I’ll make this my last post on the subject as I have nothing left to say, it’s already been well said. If you could read my post a bit more objectively instead of subjectively we could have had a nice conversation, but because of the latter you misunderstood a lot. Anyway I am happy you are in a happy marriage the world needs more happiness.
MrLovaLova (Kelly-) -
Ditto. I also hope that unrelated stuff finishes soon.
I have been watching with bewilderment… It made me a bit unwell (kind of
if someone moved my house very close to a busy highway) and I have stopped
reading this forum (evacuated I guess) for a couple of months.
How much less subtle can that message be.
Hope that is it.
I don’t see how it’s “unrelated”, we were talking about sex in marriage, and japanese-westerner marriage.
You mean it’s unrelated because you think that western guys with Japanese women are exclusive?
You can hint all you like subtly or unsubtly, i have as much right as you to post my thoughts on this forum and i’m going to continue to do so.
Mitaboy says “what many western men fail to realize is that sex is more of a performance for japanese women. they DO NOT enjoy it nor need it at the same level as western women.”, okay so why don’t you just get over it then? If you know this before you get into a relationship, you basically have the operating manual then don’t you. If you don’t think that is a good relationship for you, just don’t have a relationship with Japanese women, find a different nationality, preferably one that likes sex. Or, find a mistress to feed your sexual needs and have a Japanese wife for your status or whatever it is you find good about them. I don’t agree with it, i think basically, you guys that are having problems and seem to keep talking about it but doing nothing is just going around and around in circles without ever solving the problem, it’s a little bit stupid. If you think you can never change the situation and don’t do anything about it, surely divorce is the only answer. You can’t change the person’s personality or their culture, so what are you going to do about it? Change yourself to suit their needs or cut all ties.
i have been reading sitting here reading lots of potsts for the past couple of hours, and i have to say i find it astonishing how some posters here openly say that they’ve had a relationship for 10 or more years and during all that time, felt that their sex life was going downhill….i mean that’s just outrageous to me. how on earth could you be in a relaotionship for so long and accept this type of thing? i would go absolutely insane.
so, can we confirm that japanese women are less interested in sex than ppl from the west? i sortof refuse to believe that, since i think all women in the world want an equal amount of sex really. but that’s my view of it.
also, i noticed that some posters find sex with their wives every month, or every 3 months or whatever, to be not enough. i think it depends on the person him/herself. i would personally find sex 3-5 times a week quite a lot actually. perhaps once a week, or once every few weeks would be good. however, it does also depend on the circumstances you’re in i think. like, im not saying i would ‘always’ want to have an equal amount of sex every week or whatever. i think it should come naturally, whether sometimes its two times a week during one period or once a month during the next.
i did also have some suggestions. what if a couple, who is married, has kids and obligations etc. wants more time for themselves, just went on a short vacation a couple of times a year? we’re talking a few days, a week at most. that way the husband and wife could spend some romantic time together, and have some nice loving again. and while they are gone during that period, the parents could leave the kids at their parents’ house. how would that work?
or do you think that my views are much too western, and could never work in japan?
finally, may i say that i find that after reading all these posts, i find getting married to a japanese woman quite frightening now. there was one post above that suggested that japanese women believe they have been completely educated by the time they are 23, and thus dont see the need to change themselves at all, whereas we from the west (or i am at least) are always open for change and new learning, rather than conservatism…
This is related to the topic, though not identical to the stories here. In any case, it’s my story. When I was living in America, in college, I dated and lived with a fellow student from Japan. She was 26 and I was 22. I was at the time a very romantic person, like an artist and kind of a dreamer. We had a great connection. We loved, we shared, we laughed, we cried, everything. For those three years or so, it was kind of like being married without actually being married. I felt it was a kind of evaluation time to see if we would do well as a married couple, and I think she had similar thoughts, at least for some of the time. About sex, I was surprised that she was a virgin at 26. It seemed really uncommon, but it felt special to both of us. There are a lot of personal memories that go along with this, which was the core of the relationship. In a sense, we kind of grew up together. From the start, we had sex basically anytime. Day, night, didn’t matter. We both communicated well about it and understood exactly how to satisfy each other in that way. Over time though, I think I made a serious error — maybe because I was young, I don’t know — but over time her desire for sex became less and less frequent. Really, I could have, and should have, met her half way and not insisted on having sex all the time when she didn’t particularly want to. When I think back on it, the goal shouldn’t have been something like “maximize orgasms” — I mean, that’s really kind of trite compared to the other, deeper intimacy that we shared. Because of this, when I suggested that we marry, she cried and said “I can’t do this anymore.” I think she loved me as much as I loved her, and I just wore her out with too many demands for sex. There was also a lot of stress toward the end: work, finances, her visa about to run out kind of forced a decision one way or another. She moved back to Tokyo, resolved though I think with a heavy heart, and I was crushed. Everything just crumbled in my life. I soon lost my job, got into drugs for a while, just lost my integrity. We still kept in touch by phone because over the time we had been so close to each other that it was just bizarre to be apart. At that point, I had pretty much hit rock bottom and was overwhelmed with thoughts of resolving the situation and getting back to the way things were when it was good. Unexpectedly, her parents invited me to visit the family in Japan, saying they wanted to repay the favor that I had taken her on a vacation to Santa Fe. I think her parents basically agreed with me that we could have worked it out and made our way into married life, as soul mates. She tells me her mother said as much, and it was a point of contention between them. I was not emotionally prepared for the visit, at all. I had some kind of shock reaction to everything, and literally was unable to sleep. I ended up awake for nine days straight and more or less lost my grip on reality from the severe sleep deprivation. It was awful. I don’t actually remember much from that vacation. Fragments. I had a photo album of me doing things in Japan that I really don’t remember — riding a rickshaw through a bamboo forest, smiling in front of a waterfall, eating some kind of fish, etc. Anyway, I don’t want to veer off discussing those troubles. It took years to get over, I’ll leave it at that. Having invested so much time in learning Japanese in preparation for what I expected would be a marriage, I felt like it would all be wasted if I just brushed it away. So I decided to come to Japan on my own and see where it leads. Since then, I’ve made the mistake of trying to recreate the same relationship — a terrible mistake, because every person is unique. That’s the whole point. Now that I’m living in Japan, I look back on this and hardly recognize my old self sometimes. I’ve straightened out in a lot of ways, become more responsible, etc. But it took the first year to get beyond the compulsion to have sex with people who reminded me of my ex-girlfriend. I really regret that way of living, that way of regarding people. I went to so many sex shops, mindlessly, and this is the part of me that did not “straighten out” until after a year. It hit me like a bullet to realize, what the hell have I become? This all started with love and a desire to be married and have that union, so how did it end up with meaningless sex? I’ve decided to try another year here, living a clean life. It has been interesting to read this discussion about marriage and sex among Japanese people and (often) people from other nations. Particularly because it was the very situation I wanted more deeply than my words can express. If what I wrote makes you want to say something, I would appreciate sincere and civil feedback. Thank you for your time.
“Really, I could have, and should have, met her half way and not insisted on having sex all the time when she didn’t particularly want to.”
this lesson was learned not to worry
“the goal shouldn’t have been something like “maximize orgasms””
whose orgasms, yours or hers?
Mitaboy, thanks. Yes, it’s ironic that we really learn lessons only after the fact. In any case…
I wrote, “the goal shouldn’t have been something like “maximize orgasms””
You asked, “whose orgasms, yours or hers?”
Both. Over time as we told each other what one another likes, it was very easy to reach the top. I cared a lot about her enjoyment — and it’s stimulating to see anyway. It was kind of just obvious that if she came first, we’d both be satisfied, so that worked out well. In retrospect, I think the problem was just wanting to do it pretty much any time all the time. For me, that was a perfectly sensible desire at the time, and for her it was just too often. As for learning from it, I don’t think it makes much sense to look for someone who is into constant sex. While that would be cool — while I’d also like eternal youth and boundless intellect and winning the lottery — it just isn’t the basis anymore. The love was more important, enough so that I’d rather adapt to the frequency of sex that most women seem to need, and just enjoy a good life.
From reading all of this, I don’t know where the right person to date and probably marry will be from. If it clicks here in Japan, that’s great, and if not, that’s fine. Sometimes I’d rather that nothing works out until something right works out. Maybe she’ll be from Texas, maybe from Tokyo, I can’t just presuppose it.
Wow, that’s an incredible story, Mark. It seems that even though you couldn’t control what was going on, you still had some pretty clear insights into it. Probably you came out of the situation stronger than you went into it. Thanks for sharing.
Excellent article and I think that the role that children play in rendering their parents sexless can’t be emphasized enough. Many kids sleep with the folks until an age that would be unacceptable in the west, and still manage to sneak into the folks’ bed whenever they wake up in the middle of the night. I would chalk it up to an innate Japanese sense of “loneliness” and longing to have someone always around them.
Our kids did this for a while, but I finally had to put my foot down and march them back into their own beds each time they tried to invade ours. It was really cutting into our sex life and I saw the writing on he wall when the wifey sighed with a “shiyou ga nai” and resigned that we would just have to largely put sex on hold until the kids got a little older. You can imagine my dismay at that comment!
Often I frequent local bars and talk to many Japanese ladies…all on a “friends” basis of course. The recurring them that I hear again and again is how the husband is too busy and never pays much attention to the wife. Being the curious guy that I am, I always find an innocent way to extract more information from them about the relationship and if often comes up that the wife is neglecting the “duties of a wife”, which puts everything in perspective for me. While I’m not trying to limit the fault of the husband in the relationship, what I’ve found by and large is that the wife goes to bed early (she gets up early to get the kids off to school, etc) and the husband doesn’t get home until 9-10 pm-ish. The ones that I’ve got to open up about their sex lives flat out tell me that they reject hubby’s advances most of the time as they’re too tired to humor him.
Funny thing is, that most of them admit that after a while that the husband just stopped trying. I didn’t have the heart to tell them that he’s probably found another outlet and doesn’t see the need to beg the wife for sex anymore.
Alternatively, if you’re single perhaps you should consider patterning your love life after this guy:
http://tinyurl.com/996ref
rather than going down the marriage route. These “girl friends” never say no. wink wink
Percy, I bet if your wife knew you were out chatting to married ladies about their sex lives she wouldn’t be happy about it! What a cheek you have.
Why is it automatically the woman’s fault that the marriage is sexless because she’s tired from making your obento in the morning and getting kids off to school plus cooking dinners and putting kids to bed? Could it be too hard for you to try to get home earlier or initiate it at another appropriate time?
As a Japanese woman who has an American boyfriend, and gone through reading all these comments, it has actually put me off western guys. If they only think about themselves and about sex all the time….i don’t want any part of it. I can see why these women just let it be and say “shou ga nai” to a sexless marriage. This kind of situation only validates a woman to be good enough for sex, and puts sex on a pedestal above every other experience in a relationship.
To insist that because of a wife’s daily routine, a man would go out and have an affair is preposterous and obviously it is the man’s fault because he is susceptible to that kind of activity BEFORE the marriage or relationship occured. Don’t put your short comings onto your wife because of a situation. If sex was all that mattered to you, don’t have kids, use a condom! Otherwise hire a prostitute who is there 7 days 24 hours to satisfy you.
Okay, i get that this topic is about sexless marriages, and i agree that i have a lot of friends that say they have them, but none of their Japanese husbands make them feel like they are the ones who caused it or make them feel low because of it. The way the western guys on this forum go on, it just seems like they keep telling each other it’s the woman’s fault, if she doesn’t do X then man will go elsewhere. As far as i’m concerned, the women who have bf’s/husbands such as these would be better off without them.
I and many other Japanese women do not want to be with guys with a one-track mind.
Mami,
Wow…where to begin here? Nobody’s saying that sex is the be-all and end-all of a marriage, even though you seem to zero in on that point alone.
For your information, my wife doesn’t make a bento for me and I take the kids to school in the mornings and share in the household chores. The Japanese method of dusting just doesn’t cut it with me, so I take it upon myself to do that plus the cleaning of all the bathrooms and toilets.
Also, my wife has only a part-time job that brings in little money. Everything she earns she spends 90% of on herself. What if I just woke up one day and said “Sorry honey, with everything going on in my life and my busy schedule, I just don’t feel like working a full-time job anymore” to her? In marriage you work together to meet one another’s needs, and I think that some Japanese women dismiss sex altogether as non-essential, while still putting a high premium on brand goods and living the high life.
Did I say that I or other men require sex 24/7? No, I didn’t, did I? Once or twice a week isn’t unreasonable in my humble opinion and international polls back this premise up. Couples are having sex on an average of twice a week in other industrialized countries…Japan is an anomaly in this respect.
I also did not condone men going out and having affairs behind their wife’s back in response to their sexless marriage. Good thing that you’re not a betting woman Mami, because all the bars that I patronize are within a 5 minute walk of my home and as I said before I am doing nothing but talking to them. You would indeed lose that bet. I tell her all about the people that I talk to and she also talks to men sometimes when she goes out, which she also tells me about.
As far as my relationship with my own wife goes, I got tired of begging her for sex once or twice a week (again, this is the average in industrialized nations and not out of the ordinary and certainly not perverted) so I toned it down a bit. She did get worried when I quit asking for it and thought that I might be getting it elsewhere. 95% of the time when I ask her for sex, she would laugh it off and just say not now or tell me how tired she was. Funnily enough, when SHE wants it she cuts straight to the chase and tries to coax me into it (almost always when I’m not in the mood) or shows up in bed around 6AM fresh out of the tub and just jumps me. I don’t find this very appealing and I’ve told her that it’s ludicrous to deny me when I want it, and then to just demand it when she happens to be in the mood.
For your information, I have never cheated on my wife and don’t plan to do so anytime soon. The thought of having sex with someone I don’t love doesn’t appeal to me, and would never entertain thoughts of paying a visit to a prostitute either. Why do you assume that I didn’t want to have kids? I love my kids very much and am very active as a father. Does having kids mean that you have to give up on sex altogether? Is that the way you and most other Japanese women see it? My wife told me a little tale one time when she went for tea with a group of friends and they went around the table boasting of how little they have sex with their husbands. When one lady said that they do it once a week, she was roundly criticized for doing it too frequently and even told that she should go to the hospital because she was obviously “sick.” I’m of the opinion that the expectation amongst Japanese women to become sexless is quite high and some see it as a sort of rite of passage, so to speak. What’s more, I also think that in some cases that it is a form of revenge against the husband or a way of being a bit sadistic in denying him sex as a way to get her own rocks off by watching him suffer.
I’m not blaming Japanese women for everything that goes wrong in a marriage, but where there’s smoke there’s fire and if this many people are talking about this phenomenon, then there must be something there. If you’ve never met a Japanese guy that’s whined about his wife not wanting to have sex, then all I can say is that your exposure to Japanese men must either be very small or they don’t feel comfortable talking to you about their situation. I hear it all the time from both men and women who find me easy to talk to.
I don’t think it’s fair to say that “where there’s smoke, there’s fire”. The fact that a whole bunch of people think something doesn’t mean that it’s true. And I think trying to find someone to blame for the situation (Japanese women, Western men) is asking for trouble. I think what is productive is simply taking a close look at what’s going on. And what I see is sex taking an unhealthy role in relationships. I think the only healthy role of sex is as a mutual expression of loving emotion, literally making love. Casting it as some kind of impersonal biological impulse is unhealthy. Using it as a weapon in a passive/aggressive guerilla war is also unhealthy. I’m not against hedonistic sex, I just think that you need to recognise that it won’t do anything to help sustain a relationship of any length.
Sex should be something that brings a couple closer together. If that’s not happening, then you’re doing it wrong. And there’s no shame in that, because it’s a big ask, but you have to face the facts and deal with them.
I once read a Japanese man saying something like “the idea of sex without love is widely accepted in Japan”. So maybe the separation of sex and affection has some cultural basis, I have no idea really. But I don’t think us Westerners are all that different. But I think the bottom line is that if a woman feels loved she will want to have sex. And if family/work committments are getting in the way, it’s a shared problem, and not a time for assigning blame.
- James
Hi James,
While you bring up some good points, whether we like it or not sex is a biological imperative otherwise none of us would probably be here today. That being said, I would also say that nurturing and protecting one’s young is also a biological instinct and there is nothing impersonal about that.
“Sex should be something that brings a couple closer together. If that’s not happening, then you’re doing it wrong.”
I think that’s a pretty broad statement, and if love and sex were that simple that there would be very few posts here. Many of the women I talk to do in fact feel loved, but just don’t feel compelled to have sex with the hubby anymore. Perhaps we’re leaving out the “cultural” imperatives that I previously mentioned that can run quite strong amongst the Japanese?
Even when work/family commitments don’t really get in the way, sexless relationships in Japan abound. So much so that the government has become interested in the subject. Without assigning blame, I would think that we could at least discuss the probable causes of this issue? The problem with that is, that when you dig into an issue, there is always someone or something to blame otherwise the issue wouldn’t be an issue. Seems that we’ve become a little too PC in this day and age to effectively address issues and their real root causes.
Percy,
I’m an australian wife of a Japanese husband and i can assure you the statistics are true. It’s not only between Japanese woman and Western men that the marriage is sexless, but also between Japanese man and Western women. I’ve been married nearly 6 years and our sex life has dwindled to now being once every 3 months or about that. It’s mainly my problem and i admit that. About 2 years ago i started to get ill and the reason why we don’t have sex lately is i have a stomach tumor. My husband doesn’t ask me for sex because he thinks it will be too bad for my health. If i want sex i will ask him for it, or tell him how i feel, because apart from that he thinks i’m feeling too ill to do it.
That’s what love and relationships are all about. My husband might be chafing at the bit to have sex but he’s not, he goes with the flow because his love for me is greater than his need to have sex. Sex may be a “biological imperative” but i think compassion for your other half, and the love that you have for them should have more importance.
When we have sex, we don’t have sex, like James said, we make love, and it’s about two bodies becoming one. My husband cares about me, and cares about my needs too.
I can tell you that i have quite a few aussie/american friends who have japanese husbands too and they have no sex life either. Their husbands are all the same as mine in that they care about their wive’s health and feelings before putting the heat on them about having sex, and when they do have sex, maybe once every few months it’s meaningful, not some quickie in the bush.
I think it’s the evolution of every marriage to slow down in the bedroom department. Propably between a Japanese couple’s marriage they have problems because they find it difficult to communicate.
A Japanese woman who recently stayed with us who had been married said she never talked about sex with her husband, and never broached the subject of personal problems such as menstruation because of embarrassment. She said alot of Japanese women are the same and if they are angry they don’t say “i’ve got PMS” because it’s too personal.
The relationship between Japanese men and women is probably way different in the way they communicate about their wants and needs, and rather than “bother” the other person they just shut up about it. Inter-cultural couples however seem to be more open about discussion on all topics, and something considered “personal” or “embarrassing” between Japanese couples is talked about by between husband and wife in inter-cultural relationships.
My two cents.
Hi Percy,
As far as our species is concerned sex is indeed a biological imperative. But to digress for a moment, amongst humans there’s a lot more to it than reproduction, and its function (from a biological perspective) has a lot to do with forming strong pair bonds. Compared to other animals, humans take an extremely long time to grow from babies to adults, and require a huge investment of energy to keep them alive and healthy over this period. That’s why we need strong pair bonds, and building these bonds is one of the reasons why we have sex even when we have absolutely no intention of having a baby*.
As I said, love and sex is not simple, and getting it right is a big ask. I certainly don’t have all the answers. I don’t claim to be particularly successful. But I still believe that is what we should be aiming for.
I also think that looking at the situation in terms of frequency of sex is in conflict with the fact that desire is a dynamic thing, and more so the more experienced and jaded/bored you become. If we’re going to venture into cultural critique I would say that our western culture has an obsession with quantity that I have come to believe is misguided. I think we should reassess our expectations in this light. I’ve been having sex a lot less often than I wanted for a long time now, and I’m starting to think that maybe it’s not as much of a problem as it seemed at first.
Feel free to discuss the cultural imperatives of the Japanese, because I think perhaps you have a deeper insight into them than most of us.
“Something that is to blame” and a “cause” are two completely different things. “Blame” describes a moral judgement and engenders conflict. “Cause” is much more neutral. If you think the difference in semantics is unimportant, consider this. Lawyers assign blame, scientists seek causes. If you get a lawyer and a scientist to investigate a car crash, they’re going to reach completely different conclusions because they are investigating completely different things.
- James
* These ideas are discussed in detail in “The Human Zoo” by Desmond Morris.
A little about me. I am Australian and in my mid 30s. I hold a professional job. Whilst not Tom Cruise I feel I have enough charisma to get either an Australian girl or an Asian girl. I worked in Thailand for 2 years and whilst in Bangkok enjoyed the nightlife scene……before settling down with 1 Thai Freelancer (former sex worker).
On my return to Australia I took my father’s advice and went in pursuit of NON-Freelancer/bargirl Asian ladies. After dating a few Asian ladies in Australia (a 23 year old Taiwanese girl, a 42 year old Chinese businesswoman and a 34 year old Japanese professional) I settled for the Japanese lady. She was a Registered Nurse in Japan (qualifications are recognized in Australia), a Diving instructor in Cairns (on Green Island), service officer for a duty free store specializing in Australian wines (whilst she was studying IT full time) and finally an IT support person working for IBM. She is very middle class – having earned above average money all her life. She holds a Japanese bachelors degree in Nursing and has also completed half an Australian IT degree (that is quite hard stuff to pass!). She had been married before to an older Australian.
I have been married to my Japanese wife for 4 years and now have 2 young children to this Japanese lady. She is a very good mother and currently works as a registered nurse (earning slightly more than me!). She is a loyal loving wife. She is an excellent cook (certainly better than my previous Australian wife) and is very nice to life with. We spend time together each day discussing the day’s events and getting the children ready for bed. We share many hobby’s together – we both have a love for the finer things in life. She is a wonderful wife HOWEVER…….
HOWEVER I miss my previous Thai freelancer wife’s sexual affection!
Let me explain.
Whilst my Japanese wife has never denied me any sexual relations there is still something missing. My wife loves me yet she has the eroticism of a plastic dolphin bought from Seaworld. I said eroticism – my wife is certainly beautiful however she really does not try and be a sexual creature. Personally I have learned a lot from the Bargirls in Thailand! I tell my wife constantly SHE IS A HANDSOME LADY! ….. or words to that effect. I tell her daily that I love her and that I enjoy my time with her. (If the Thai bargirls can use this to great effect…. Why can’t I ?). I constantly hug her and kiss her. I tell her she is my “sexy girl”. I often use the line “where you go sexy girl?”
My wife enjoys my attention however when things turn intimate she is rather cold and mechanical.
There is something missing. Lately when I put my hand down my wife’s top she moves slightly away. I don’t like this prudish behavior. I once advised my wife to be careful when bending over in a certain short dress….. from that point onwards she wore tights with the dress. I told her I was just advising her to be careful…. Not revert to a prude.
I can remember my freelancer wife asking me many times “if I wanted a blo_job?” or even better….. “come here and f_ck my brains out!” I remember one time my boss had a bed delivered to my work. My freelancer wife came up to me and asked if we could “f_ck on the bed first!….. before my boss got a chance to use the bed” If I touched my freelancer intimately she would encourage the actions.
Middle class girls – whether Japanese, Thai or any other variety do not have the skills of a former freelancer. They do not possess the sexual confidence to pull off outrageous stunts! And those stunts are what make life so enjoyable.
Whilst I can see the problems in having a ex-freelancer as a wife there are certainly advantages. It is very similar to owning a car. A Japanese Honda will be reliable, safe and very middle class…… HOWEVER an Alfa Romeo will have passion, excitement and romance albeit until the next $2000- repair! (Yes I have also owned both these makes of cars!)
Yes I love my middle class Japanese wife very much however I can never forget the cute ex-freelancer who wanted to do nasty things on the boss’s mattress! I am just not so sure how I can explain this to my Japanese wife.
Hey man,
Can’t you see your “middle class” Japanese wife is already sick of you? She doesn’t let you touch her anymore. She probably feels like a piece of meat already.
Stop comparing her to what you once had. She’ll never live up to your expectations if you did. That was then, this is now.
You gave up the life with the Thai girl for her so just enjoy what you have. The thai girl probably can’t know what’s real and what’s working, that’s why she’s got sex on the brain.
I enjoy my life with my Japanese wife too. I enjoy the Japanese way. I appreciate her for all she does for me and we spend time the way we both want, not the man driving the relations. You got it all wrong.
AussieBob
not sure if you are a talented lover or not. that might be an issue.
a) please explain the logic of comparing a professional sex worker to one who isn’t? by the way, unless you know what you’re looking a professional can be very good at appearing to enjoy your ’sexual prowess’. that’s her JOB! hint: it is not the moaning and calling of your manly name, ‘AussieBob’.
b) please explain why ANY woman wants to be compared to any woman for any reason?
i often counsel foreign men in tokyo one on one on how to have successful realtionships by first illuminating the STUPID things they say and do. NOT that the individuals themselves are STUPID, but they do and say stupid things.
be sure to read the numerous posts on this thread on what NOT to say and do before pointing out the logic of your responses to the two questions above (^ _ ^)//
AussieBob
not sure if you are a talented lover or not. that might be an issue.
a) please explain the logic of comparing a professional sex worker to one who isn’t? by the way, unless you know what you’re looking a professional can be very good at appearing to enjoy your ’sexual prowess’. that’s her JOB! hint: it is not the moaning and calling of your manly name, ‘AussieBob’.
b) please explain why ANY woman wants to be compared to any woman for any reason?
i often counsel foreign men(some from this site) in tokyo one on one on how to have successful realtionships by first illuminating the STUPID things they say and do. NOT that the individuals themselves are STUPID, but they do and say stupid things.
be sure to read the numerous posts on this thread on what NOT to say and do before pointing out the logic of your responses to the two questions above (^ _ ^)//
to the admin: wordpress was not functioning properly, please delete 308
Hello,
Yes – I regard myself as a good lover…. always happy to give! Always happy to make her happy…. I have read many books and I am not affraid to go down….. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE!
The technique is not the issue…. the issue is the Japanese mind set!
Regarding my ex-freelancer wife (former prostitute)….. PLEASE all understand that she is always a person still – A LITTLE RESPECT PLEASE. I always gave her the respect she deserved. She was forced into prostitution to support twin girls after the father/husband ran off with another lady.
Please refrain from all the disrespect I see generated here because I dared to tell the truth. Yes she was a prostitute ….. but once we were together she stopped all that. We lived together as husband and wife.
The ex-freelancer has sucessfully married another foreigner and they have recently had a child together in a western country. I stay in touch as friends. I basically ran out of money in a bad business….. and I had to leave urgently to repay debts. Nothing this girl ever did. She was the most honest person I ever met.
HOW HONEST WAS THIS GIRL? Well when things improved (and she was in this new relationship) I sent her AU$4,000- to buy back the 1ct Diamond ring I bought her – she was in a new relationship and did not want the ring but wanted the money for her children. I wired the money to her bank account and she fedex the ring. I was a bit of a small time diamond dealer – diamond was a 1.01ct VS2 I Round Brilliant cut stone in a platinum setting….. for all you diamond experts. I originally paid about AU$3500 for the stone but paid her a bit more as prices were higher at the time.
As for my relationship with my Japanese wife… personally I would never stay in a relationship without a good sex life. Sure we can skip a night if she is tired….. but no more than 2 nights skipped in a row thank you. When my wife told me once she was very tired I told her ok….. but you had better make time for our relationship tomorrow as I am starting to really hate you.
Life is too short for 2 things…..
1) Life is too short to wear a cheap watch (me – Breitling Navi, Omega Speedie, Rolex Datejust, Cartier Santos – her 2 x 18K cartier, Rolex President with diamonds, Rolex Datejust).
2) Life is too short to not get sex at least every 2 days.
You’re a PIG Aussie bob and bring shame to all us Aussies.
Bob,
It’s fine to vent, so please don’t feel that you need to censor yourself, just continue as is. Just to recap, you miss the passion of the woman you knew before. Now you’re married to a person with different values/behavior. You’ve told us that you consider your wife’s behavior prudish (compared to what you knew before). You’ve also said that you feel she is mechanical when it comes to intimacy.
I can’t help but notice you said you expect to have sex regularly, with no more than two days between. Do you think that regularity may be contributing to the mechanical feeling of it? What might happen if you did something spontaneous? Given your collection of watches, it sounds like you can afford a romantic vacation. What if you didn’t have sex for a while, a week or more, and then took a kind of dream romantic vacation? Aside from adding more variety to the way things are, you might consider couple’s counseling as a way to communicate in a non-combative way.
Again, I know it feels good to vent, and there’s nothing wrong with that. But it seems to me that by venting, it’s a way of saying that you’re not satisfied with the way things are. These problems seem entirely fixable. In part by good communication, and in part by compromise. I don’t think the psychology of dominance has nearly as much worth or benefit once you are married though. You might start by finding out more about what turns her on. It sounds like her being turned on would go a long way toward turning you on. Win-win.
Thank you Adam for your words of support.
Kelly – didn’t your Japanese mother tell you to say nothing if you are going to say bad things.
I am a very generous man…. however my time, generosity comes at a cost. That cost is affection and intimacy.
I will not put up with a sex-less marriage. END OF STORY.
We have never had more than 3 days without sex….. even when the children were born (the horrible 6 weeks window – thank you I only needed to wait 3 weeks in each case) I received oral every night once home.
The reason I am on this site is to learn how to stop my wife slipping into the evil wench many of you have already! I want to learn how to stop it without replacing the wife. (I actually like this Japanese lady… just wanting to end her prudish way with me).
If necessary I will divorce and remarry – this time a Chinese or Thai. This is my 3rd marriage so far.
I am not afraid of divorcing…. just like buying a car. The new model always seems better than the model you are replacing.
I am generous to a tee. Many big nice diamonds, 30+ pieces of Louis Vuitton (see I am accepting of her culture) and many big ticket watches.
[IMG]http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/ENTIRE%202009/IMG_0004.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/BOXSELECTION.jpg[/IMG]
SORRY if I offend…. But I am honest to a tee….
Why post on a forum is you are not 100% honest?
Please don’t be offended by my “self-made” style or brashness…..
I am a softie at heart. I am also a realist.
Please don’t be upset when I tell the truth.
Hello Adam,
Thank you for your kind posting… such a nice posting compared to Kelly (Kelly sounds like my 1st wife!)
To answer your questions:-
“What if you didn’t have sex for a while, a week or more…..” I WILL GO MAD. LIFE IS TOO SHORT NOT TO HAVE FUN. WHAT IF I DONATED ALL MY MONEY TO THE MORMANS? WHAT IF I GREW VEGETABLES IN THE BACKYARD? THERE ARE THINGS IN LIFE ONE DOES NOT EVER WANT TO DO!
“You might consider couple’s counseling…” IF IT GOT TO THAT STAGE I THINK DIVORCE WOULD BE SIMPLER. I AM NOT INTERESTED IN ANYTHING BESIDES GETTING WHAT I EXPECT. I HATE COUNSELLORS, LAWYERS AND AUSSIE LADIES – BUT NOT NECESSARILY IN THAT ORDER!
AussieBob
“the issue is the Japanese mind set!” as a result of culture, not likely to change. she is an adult. ‘LOVE’ often changes the mindset, that ingredient doesn’t appear to be here. by the sound of it, you have money, money does not buy LOVE.
sounds like your wife serviced you, difficult to discern whether she WANTED to please you or sex was just another task on the to-do-list and she ‘did you’.
spend your money on a romantic getaway. maybe she’ll be convinced to start servicing you again.
divorce is a possibility, if in japan, be prepared to lose the kids.
I totally agree with Mitaboy.
Sorry if my comments sound nasty but i don’t know why you ask about your problems and how to fix it. It’s obvious that she’s not going to change. And if you say, trading in women for another, like buying a new car, it seems like you’re objectifying women. They are just objects for your sexual service, nothing more. That’s what it seems like to me, from a female perspective.
Unfortunately, she has let herself be bought with louis vuitton handbags. It’s prostitution in a way. You reward her sexual acts with gifts, it’s just like paying for services rendered.
That’s the way I see it.
AusieB, you’re a real job aren’t you. How can you get on a public forum like this, and tell us how you want to replace your wife because she doesn’t wet your end like your previous whore bag Thai girl. Why don’t you just have yourself a daughter, and when she reaches age 5 have her suck you off when your wife isn’t erotic enough. Then you can orphan her out when she gets sick of your cum and bites your dick off. You really are a frikin nutcase, I can’t believe I am spending my time reading your shit. Go to Thailand and catch some VDs (at least you’ll “have fun”!). Fruitcake…
There are so many comments about gaijin men and their sexless lives with Japanese women.
What about us gaijin women here in Japan?? Do you think it is any better with Japanese men?
Sex goes right out of the window after a few years in a relation, once they know you are there forever with them. They don’t make any efforts to change it, sweep it under the rug and continue with the ‘gaman’ concept for the rest of their lives, just like their parents did!
I also want to add that having been in 2 long term relations with Jap. men, they never ever handed their paycheck to a gaijin wife or long term partner. I ‘ve always have had to work and pay my share and often his share of life too…
So here we are we want sex we don’t get any on top of the guy doesn’t give us any money or spoil us. It isn’t like we foreign women ever ask the guy for a $5000 Louis Vitton bag or crap like that!
Girls if you wanna have fun, don’t ever choose a Japanese man.
Cheeze
AusieB, you’re a real job aren’t you. How can you get on a public forum like this, and tell us how you want to replace your wife because she doesn’t wet your end like your previous whore bag Thai girl. Why don’t you just have yourself a daughter, and when she reaches age 5 have her suck you off when your wife isn’t erotic enough. Then you can orphan her out when she gets sick of your cum and bites your dick off. You really are a frikin nutcase, I can’t believe I am spending my time reading your shit. Go to Thailand and catch some VDs (at least you’ll “have fun”!). Fruitcake…
HOW ABOUT A BIT OR RESPECT FOR THE THAI GIRL…. WHY DO YOU CALL HER A “WHORE BAG” ? SHE IS A PERSON PLEASE….. WHAT IS WITH THE TERRIBLE INCEST COMMENT….. THIS IS THE WORST POSTING I HAVE EVER SCENE.
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/BOXSELECTION.jpg
I really do not like the abuse from the forum…. I entered this forum as a friend and I seem to have angered some people.
I thought the issue was sexless-marriage?
AussieBob
if you wanted to blow of steam, GREAT!!! you did it! mybe you feel better?
if you were looking for possible solutions
then read the tone of your your ““self-made” style or brashness…..” imagine if that tone would be conducive to receiving constructive feedback in a meeting of any sort then evaluate the responses you got here.
if you believe nothing of value was penned here, just divorce her and stop complaining.
“This is my 3rd marriage so far. I am not afraid of divorcing…. just like buying a car. The new model always seems better than the model you are replacing.”
‘3rd marriage’ things that make you go hhhmmmmmm, would you dare think, “I COULD BE THE PROBLEM?!”
‘The new model seems better…’ perhaps your powers of perception need development?
I WOULD LIKE TO RESPOND TO THE FOLLOWING POSTING BELOW….
I do not take any notice of her bullshit moves…. I do not get discouraged by her moves.
I am about to have it out with her on this issue…. I will report back the results.
I will not put up with a non-providing wife.
A japanese proverb – A honorable salaryman without a job is a bum.
I uphold my end of the above bargain…. I expect service in return.
eg. you buy an SL Mercedes…. you expect a certain level of performance. If you don’t get that performance there are heaps of other cars in that market….. ie Porsche 911, Jaguar XK8, Ashton Martin….. need I go on?
She gets Mercedes Benz type gifts and I expect Mercedes Benz service.
************************************************
Shuji Ono
Hey man,
Can’t you see your “middle class” Japanese wife is already sick of you? She doesn’t let you touch her anymore. She probably feels like a piece of meat already.
Hi Bob,
Well, good luck with it. I do think you might be in conflict in a one way though. When you talk about the person who actually was a prostitute, you’ve pointed out that she too is a person as should be treated as such. But when you talk about your current wife, you compared her to models of cars and talked about a kind of quid-pro-quo of sex in exchange for a lavish lifestyle. If you hold both value systems, which seem to be opposites, it creates authenticity problems. You might find more peace of mind if you pick one way of thinking or the other — I’m not going to suggest which — and stick with it.
As for getting a mix of positive and negative feedback, it goes with the territory.
I think you’ll find happiness, but it may not be exactly what you have in mind.
Adam
For goodness’ sake, drop the car analogy already. Comparing women to objects is a sure-fire way to get yourself in a mess. If you are really serious about avoiding a sexless marriage, you’ll need to start thinking of her as a person with needs and feelings.
AussieBob, maybe your wife is like you? Did you ever think that she only objectifies you as a “money making machine”? Apart from that, you mean nothing to her, and she certainly doesn’t think that the exchange for you providing her with money means that she has to act like she actually likes having sex with you. I too am Japanese (female). But unfortunately my husband doesn’t provide me with Mercedes Benz. But, even if he did, it wouldn’t mean I need to change who I am, and act like I enjoy making him feel pleasure.
You said she still has sex with you, she is just not erochik enough for you. I can tell you one secret. Many girls I know only act erochik with their boyfriends at the start, because it is a novelty. But once they don’t like sex anymore, most girls just stop having it, and they don’t care about the guy. Most girls (except your Thai “friend” it seems) wont make their life into a constant act of looking like they get excited while pleasing your penis. You should feel lucky she still opens her legs for you anymore (I wouldn’t!). I think you are going to change girls for your whole life – just like some people find it important to change cars! But no car these type of people have ever makes them happy.
Mayu
you write well. would you consider being a guest writer for me?
if yes, it is okay for the administrator to give you my email address
Hello All,
My Japanese wife is no prostitute. I did not ever buy her. It certainly would have been cheaper to hire somebody for that! I can assure you about that…..
I bought her beautiful things because I love her. The fact the intimacy is below par now is part of the course. I am working at discussing the issue with her and seeking an improvement or replacement.
I am an incredibly loving, generous man….. I have bought her things that 99% of the population could never own…..
Please take a look at some of her (and our) beautiful stuff.
PLEASE TAKE A LOOK BEFORE CASTING ME AS THE EVIL OGOR!!!
HER WATCHES:-
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Rolex%20DateJust/PRESIDENT/IMG_0007.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Rolex%20DateJust/Ladies%20DateJust/IMG_0009.jpg
LAST NIGHT WAS FANTASTIC!
Probably best not to shoot from the hip (like I do here)….. take it easy – be firm on insisting but pleasant and nice on the surface!!! (Beat the japs at their own game!)
Had a fantastic session last night….. I provided service to her firstly and then had my fun.
I am going to resume buying expensive baubles for her!!!
Jap girls can be the greatest…..
LESSON TO ALL YOU GUYS – Take what is yours! Be that strong demanding Jap guy, insist on service….. but of course don’t be stingy…. Chanel 5 or other needs to be given to oil the wheels!
I spend big – but demand big! NOTHING IS FREE IN THIS WORLD!
MORE TOYS I HAVE BOUGHT HER….
South Sea Pearl Necklace (about the price of a car)
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Jewellery%20Collection/pearlsm.jpg
South Sea Pearl earrings – 13.3mm size pearls! AMAZING
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Jewellery%20Collection/100_0596.jpg
Hello,
I am in a loving relationship with my Japanese wife… we have 2 kids together and I have provided her with Luxury Goods which are so important to Japanese people.
I have a Japanese magazine called “BRAND MAGAZINE” in it features “HAPPY TIMES WITH ROLEX”
…does that mean you will be sad with a Seiko? Or miserable with a Citizen watch?
YOU SEE – I AM NOT THE EVIL MATERIALIST GUY….. THE JAPS INVENTED THAT GENRE YEARS AGO!
I just feed my wife’s desire for luxury with JAW DROPPING stuff……
And for all you people….. I am MIDDLE CLASS on MIDDLE CLASS MONEY! I bought most of my stuff USED – 2nd hand….
I spent years learning about LUXURY GOODS!
I DO NOT SELL THINGS THESE DAYS…. I JUST WANT MY JAP WIFE TO BE HAPPY (and provide the service I should be entitled to).
DIAMONDS I HAVE BOUGHT HER
Diamonds… where do I start?
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Jewellery%20Collection/Diamonds/100_1442.jpg
Edwardian Bracelet (over $10K)
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Jewellery%20Collection/100_0593.jpg
This is the way to get great bedroom experience when travelling….
ALL LOUIS VUITTON LUGGAGE…..
Only probably is that the luggage can not be used on a plane….. working class airport staff like destroying LV!
THIS IS HOW WE TRAVEL….
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/resort/101_1543.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/resort/101_1566.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/resort/101_1553.jpg
I think I was being a bit over-sensitive…. SINCERE APOLOGIES.
The important thing is to not put up with these Japanese Wenches lack of service.
Japanese women are some of the most attractive, beautiful ladies in the world…. it is a sin not to have regular sexual relations with such a cut, gorgeous lady.
It kind of reminds me of the guy’s who keep a perfect Ferrari in the garage….. 20 years old but with 1500kms on the clock….. such a waste…. so many good experiences missed! Or for some other guy to enjoy when he leaves/dies/gets divorced.
Japanese ladies like a strong guy…. especially 1 with a lust for luxury goods.
I am never stingy with my wife….. when I get a bonus from work…. she gets a present….. when I get an inheritance…. she gets some goodies! LIFE CAN BE GOOD!
Latest present because I just got a $10K bonus from work….
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/Alma/100_1529.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Louis%20Vuitton/Alma/100_1540.jpg
Couples whose sex life gradually drop off:
Many of the factors you have mentioned above are very valid, but there’s one more that nobody has mentioned yet.
The effects of the dopamine high during seduction/sex and the crash later when you come off it after climax. This is explored in depth in reuniting.info (I have no affiliation).
I think the Japanese just take a different approach to dealing with the affects of this.
Hello Relaxandflow,
I would like to reply to your interesting email.
I explained to my wife that the only DOPE in the equation is her if she withdrawals service…..
MY SEX DRIVE IS THE SAME AS IT HAS EVER BEEN! AND I EXPECT TO BE SERVICED WHEN I AM IN A MARRIAGE.
Thank god I am firm in expecting good service……
*********************************************************
relaxandflow
Couples whose sex life gradually drop off:
Many of the factors you have mentioned above are very valid, but there’s one more that nobody has mentioned yet.
The effects of the dopamine high during seduction/sex and the crash later when you come off it after climax. This is explored in depth in reuniting.info (I have no affiliation).
I think the Japanese just take a different approach to dealing with the affects of this.
as ‘arsenio hall’ used too say, “things that make you go hhhmmm…”
dopamine management…
buy the japanese wife expensive gifts – dopamine management
buy the prostitute(call girll) expensive gifts(or heck! just give money) – payment for services rendered
You must be sick in the head if you find it necessary to photograph and post pictures on the net of your wifes accessories bought by you.
There’s no way in hell that I would stay with a control freak like you.
My Japanese husband buys me stuff, expensive stuff, designer bags, but only because I ask him for them, and only because he earns a really good wage, higher than most people living in Australia.
He doesn’t “buy” me either. We have sex as a love act, not a bought and paid for act.
You seem to forget that sex is about LOVE not money.
If you wanted to own a pet, why don’t you get a kitten.
Women are not toys for your pleasure. You are a sick man. You need some help, seriously.
Does your wife know you photograph her possessions?
I WISH TO RESPOND TO KELLY.
Hello Kelly,
I have photograph the items for 3 reasons. 1) My insurance covers requires it and 2) I am a member on many other forums – Rolex Watches, Louis Vuitton, Jewellery and Diamond forums. I really love the items photographed and wish to share the joy of beautiful with people. 3) Photography is a hobby of mine…. did you like the photos?
I just bought my wife a bunch of brand name perfume and body wash. I want her to stay loving and not turn into an evil Japanese sex-less wench. It is an investment in my relationship with her. Money well spent.
Kelly – do you hold out sex with your husband? How long do you go between sessions?
******************************************
Kelly
You must be sick in the head if you find it necessary to photograph and post pictures on the net of your wifes accessories bought by you.
There’s no way in hell that I would stay with a control freak like you.
My Japanese husband buys me stuff, expensive stuff, designer bags, but only because I ask him for them, and only because he earns a really good wage, higher than most people living in Australia.
He doesn’t “buy” me either. We have sex as a love act, not a bought and paid for act.
You seem to forget that sex is about LOVE not money.
If you wanted to own a pet, why don’t you get a kitten.
Women are not toys for your pleasure. You are a sick man. You need some help, seriously.
Does your wife know you photograph her possessions?
Aussie Bob! Hahahahahaha. What a dick.
REPLY TO MARV….
At least I am getting some…. WHAT ARE YOU GETTING????
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Clocks/MVC-006F.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq226/yuki69girl/Clocks/per1.jpg
I would like to respond to the following posting…..
As General McArthur once said….”Managing the Japanese is like dealing with 13 year old kids….”
Remember that and all will be understood.
************************************
as ‘arsenio hall’ used too say, “things that make you go hhhmmm…”
dopamine management…
buy the japanese wife expensive gifts – dopamine management
buy the prostitute(call girll) expensive gifts(or heck! just give money) – payment for services rendered
Mayu,
Thanks for your insight. It’s great to hear the other side of the argument. Do you mind if I ask you why your friends stop enjoying it? Is it because they were unsatisfied with their husbands? Do you think it was because their husbands weren’t good lovers? Do you think they would have continued if they enjoyed it more? I guess I’m asking you – why didn’t they enjoy it?
Mitaboy,
Stop trying to take it off line. Leave the interaction on line so we can all benefit from it.
Hills-zoku
“Mitaboy,
Stop trying to take it off line. Leave the interaction on line so we can all benefit from it.”
sorry, don’t know what you mean
Mitaboy, I mean comments 150, 216, 258 etc
oops. meant 358 (not 258)
hills-zoku,
please don’t misunderstand, not trying to take offline, i do not profit from it at all.
some people would prefer not to read comments to their issues that amount to target practice. those offers were(are) made and accepted by those in that category
A question regarding Japanese men for Mayu or any other Japanese woman on this list. Does your husband/boyfriend do anything to excite you or give you pleasure? Is there more to sex than him putting his penis inside you?
im 25 from the philippines married my husband an we live each other 2 years ago, i am very sexless women who always begging my husband to have sex with me, he always stress at work and many excuses when i want it, we have sex for once in a two-months, im stress how can i change it and i feel hurt when he is watching porn in internet lead him to masturbate. im so sad and always crying.. ilove my husband and i want him to the rest of my life and i know that he loves me too, im young not ugly and good body but i dont undestand whythis happen,
pls tell me what can i do?
i talk to him about this manner but nothing is changes
im still hoping he may change.
jen
somebody can advice me of this matter, i talk to my japanese husband lastday i tell him what my side and im feeling when he is doin this, but he doesnt want to listen what im talking about, he said that is normal to guy to masturbate and i know that, but i really dont understand that we live together and always hoping that he do the first move.. im so sad and desperate.. pls aomebody will help me, i need some advice
jen
jen
“always hoping that he do the first move.. im so sad and desperate.”
the solution may be EASY! first, stop hoping! waste of energy. second, you are not a japanese woman, make ‘the first move’ yourself.
thank you mitaboy
i always do the first move but he always reject my invitation, he always sayin that he is not in condition (tired) but one day i go to my friend house and im back he sleeping and when i see the pc theres a lot of porn video he watched and the evidence(tissue) that he do masturbation to himself,
i dont understand why he need to that way supposedly im here and very open what he want,
and last night i talked to him about this he doesnt want to listen to me and insted he said this a normal to a guy and he always do this before we met, and he told me that its not normal to a married girl to ask about sex and also he said that girls do also masturbation which i really hate…
im tired thinkin of we have a diifrent culture, religion…
im young and i want to enjoy it with my only love,
and one thing he very sweet person, kind everthing and i know that he loves me
but only one thing he always not give me a (sex)
pls anwer me mitaboy
thanks, godbless
jen
“i know that he loves me but only one thing he always not give me a (sex)”
IF he loves you… sex should not be an issue.
1) how long have you been married?
2) how frequent has sex ever been?
3) do you work?
4) do you have children?
5) what kind of work does he do?
6) how many days a week does he work?
7) when does he get home?
9) how often does he indulge in his hobbies?
10) how often is he out with friends?
please answer all 10 questions
jen,
sorry
the happy face is a mistype
1) we married for almost 2 years
2) once in a month
3) presently im not working.. last december i decide to resign to have quality time for him.
4) dont have yet
5) he work in car company (mechanical enginneer)
6) 5 to 6 times a week
7) he always at time going home,
his hobbies is pc, psp, manga (kind of anime book)
9) almost everyday
10) never, he dont want to out with his friends, actually he has only one friend
jen,
once a month is low even for japanese couples
1) in your other relationships, how often did you have sex?
2) why did you get married?
please DO NOT say because i loved him. give me details.
3) what time does he come home everyday 5:00pm? 10:00pm?
please answer all questions
1) im my other relationship atleast once or twice a week
2) we met in a club then he starting courting me for 3 months we go out in nice place, he always want me suprise (place, gift etc.) then he prupose on me to become his wife and i say yes, i enjoy the first 4 months of our relationship we are active(once a week) but it changes, i dont know why? we dont have big quarrel but sometime we argue
i alway cook for him and preparing his hot-bath evrything in the house that wife do.
to define him very caring,sweet until now but one thing i dont really understand is about sex, he dont want to talk about it, he say we have the right time and the right mood, but he always dont have it,
he always on time around 7:00-7:15 pm
jen
1) had you had sex with your husband BEFORE you got married?
2) if yes, how often?
3) if yes, where? his home or a love hotel?
4) was he your first japanese lover?
5) if no, how frequently did you have sex with previous japanese lovers?
6) VERY IMPORTANT: was sex usually at the lovers home or hotel?
please study all the answers you’ve given
1) yes
2)before once or twice aweek
3) home and love hotel too..
4)no, hes my second time japanese bf
5)one to twice a week
6) both of it my bf homes and sometimes in a hotel
jen,
my guess is that you did not study the nature of japanese dating and sexuality BEFORE you got married.
1) did you know that statistically japanese people are ranked among the lowest in annual sexual contact? somewhere around 50 times a year and it drops SHARPLY after marriage.
japanese women often say that men marry mothers and maids. you are not a mother yet…
2) if you knew the above why did you think your married life would be different?
do you mean its normal here , and i have to admit it?
(i really thank you for the advice it would help alot for me)
jen
in all of my relationships with japanese women i tell them of my sexual expectations within the first two to three weeks of our relationship. my sexual expectation is three – four times a week. IF it falls below that and i decide to leave i’ve already told them in advance. it is not a surprise. quite frankly, most japanese women are hard pressed to even enjoy sexual contact at even two to three times a week. this is in part due to performance issues with japanese men.
also keep in mind that many japanese people ascribe more importantance to their employer than their home or dating life.
i’m writing an article on sexual expectations and may post a link if the administrator doesn’t mind.
now that i understand living life here is different, yes i dont need to wait( just wasting my time)
im planning to work next month it think it would help me because it make me bussy.
i love my husband so i have to respect him and his decision
i hope that i can read your article about sexual expectation,
and i really thank you for the advice
godbless,
jen
What makes mitaboy the xpert. Hes not even married to a Japanese.
It’s wrong what he says. There are alot of Japanese married couples enjoying sex frequently.
I’ve been married for 10 years to my aussie hubs and we have sex many times per week because we love each other and both enjoy it. plus he’s slow and makes pleasuring me his interest. We bothf ind new ways to pleasure each other. Sometimes i get a book from the library that tells me how to different ways of pleasuring. It’s good fun!
We also sometimes to strip shows together or watch porn. I am happy with him. He respects me and I respect him and we love ach other deeply.
Some of my friends are married to aussie guys and they have the same relationship as i do with mine. Mitaboy is stereotyping us into a category, he doesnt know what he’s talking about.
Mariko
There is no need to ACCEPT what I say.
no one has to.
one may do government or private sector research to verify what has been stated. i’ve not only done research but have had researchers speak directly to me.
it is true that research can be skewed. however, there is overwhelming ‘evidence’ that is supposedly based on acceptable research practices that would confirm the statements made.
you may be one of many,” We also sometimes to strip shows together or watch porn” congratulations! but the sample of which you may represent is not the majority of the ‘japanese people who-have-sex’ population. (^_^)//
check it for yourself.
AUSSIEBOB COMES CLEAN!!!!
Hello All,
Just having a bit of a laugh with you guys. I borrowed some picks from another forum on collectables and joined it up with my Japanese wife.
Trying to get a few laughs…
But you guys seem to be too interested in criticising somebody’s hobby because you can’t afford this type of stuff.
Personally I am not of the view a relationship can be bought. I am who I am.
Mind you…. my Japanese wife does give me the shits at times…..
Why am I not surprised?
This has been an insightful discussion at its best. At least when people aren’t trying to stir things up.
Things Have Improved Greatly…
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Hello,
Since I had a talk to my wife – AFTER MUCH ADVICE FROM THIS SUPPERB FORUM – …. things have improved.
I did not mention the word “SEX” once…. what I said was “you don’t seem to have any time to kiss and cuddle me anymore…” “you act like a prude when I try and touch you…..”
I told her “I am not going to put up with this lack of contact for more than 6 months…. 6-12 months and I am divorced from you if things continue like this….”
I also told her “I am really pissed off how you always have time to clean up crap around the house but you do not have time to spend with me….what is more important…. you can giving me signals that I should really be l